Advice on Vendetta gearing
- Thread starter Nigel399
- Start date
ratz
Wielder of the Rubber Mallet
Compact Double; 52/36 and
Compact Double; 52/36 and 11-28T on the back with the 17T removed and replaced with a 16T. We are all short-steep hills around here; either we are running on the flat or climbing less that 0.5 miles. I'm happier with that so far than a 11-26T; but honestly I could be running an 11-23 or 11-25; I'd just have to be dropping into the 36 more often. Thanks to the Yaw derailleurs I probably cross chain more often then I should on short climbs and rollers.
Compact Double; 52/36 and 11-28T on the back with the 17T removed and replaced with a 16T. We are all short-steep hills around here; either we are running on the flat or climbing less that 0.5 miles. I'm happier with that so far than a 11-26T; but honestly I could be running an 11-23 or 11-25; I'd just have to be dropping into the 36 more often. Thanks to the Yaw derailleurs I probably cross chain more often then I should on short climbs and rollers.
Rick Youngblood
CarbonCraft Master
I will be running my
I will be running my Frankenstein setup on my new just (today) purchased V2. Same thing I'm running on my S2, actually moving it over for now. I live in mountain area unlike Bob. But I think his set is perfect for rollers and very short hills.
Now don't laugh guys, here is mine:
Sram Rival compact double up front with 53t Q-ring and 34t Q-ring. Rear derailleur is SRAM Via GT long cage, Drive cassette is 13-42 toothed (would love to have the 11 back on some of the long descents, but I live), 28-32 used on most climbing 6-8% (not rollers though). I've got the Sram Force 22 Yaw too, best FD I've ever used. I get into the 36 and 42 on 10% - 15% and plus on the long hill climbs, or as a bail out, or to recover and rest through the climb. But I think as I get stronger/better at climbing, 32 or 36 at the most. Now this is on my Silvio, and I'm not sure what to expect on the V2. But I can surly tell you, you don't need the tiny gear inches on these bike that you do on the rear drive high racers.
Anyway so 5 days plus or minus, ot therabout, and counting, let the good times roll!!
I will be running my Frankenstein setup on my new just (today) purchased V2. Same thing I'm running on my S2, actually moving it over for now. I live in mountain area unlike Bob. But I think his set is perfect for rollers and very short hills.
Now don't laugh guys, here is mine:
Sram Rival compact double up front with 53t Q-ring and 34t Q-ring. Rear derailleur is SRAM Via GT long cage, Drive cassette is 13-42 toothed (would love to have the 11 back on some of the long descents, but I live), 28-32 used on most climbing 6-8% (not rollers though). I've got the Sram Force 22 Yaw too, best FD I've ever used. I get into the 36 and 42 on 10% - 15% and plus on the long hill climbs, or as a bail out, or to recover and rest through the climb. But I think as I get stronger/better at climbing, 32 or 36 at the most. Now this is on my Silvio, and I'm not sure what to expect on the V2. But I can surly tell you, you don't need the tiny gear inches on these bike that you do on the rear drive high racers.
Anyway so 5 days plus or minus, ot therabout, and counting, let the good times roll!!
Rick Youngblood
CarbonCraft Master
Edit above, "or" not "ot".
Edit above, "or" not "ot". Can't seem to get back into an existing thread to edit.
Edit above, "or" not "ot". Can't seem to get back into an existing thread to edit.
ratz
Wielder of the Rubber Mallet
How the heck....
Ok How the heck Did you get the Force 22 aligned to do a 53/34 on the front? I barely got Mrs Ratz 50/34 to work on the Silvio braze-on. Did you bore our the braze-on? Obviously you'll get rub on the big ring if you try and use the 34T with the 15,14,13 positions; but still who cares if it can shift on the 53/34 cleanly I may have to go look at mine again.
Hmmm A 34 on the crank would let me put at 11-26T or a 11-23T on the wheel. Very interesting.
On the V with hills I'm quickly finding I do like the lower 6 to be a corncob of tightly space gears; and the upper four to be a wide and high climbing set; I tend to be in one extreme or the other; and rarely in between. Yeah you have to buy two cassettes and Frankenstein it; but it works.
I'm really curious who the Q-rings really perform; would be nice if we had some data
Ok How the heck Did you get the Force 22 aligned to do a 53/34 on the front? I barely got Mrs Ratz 50/34 to work on the Silvio braze-on. Did you bore our the braze-on? Obviously you'll get rub on the big ring if you try and use the 34T with the 15,14,13 positions; but still who cares if it can shift on the 53/34 cleanly I may have to go look at mine again.
Hmmm A 34 on the crank would let me put at 11-26T or a 11-23T on the wheel. Very interesting.
On the V with hills I'm quickly finding I do like the lower 6 to be a corncob of tightly space gears; and the upper four to be a wide and high climbing set; I tend to be in one extreme or the other; and rarely in between. Yeah you have to buy two cassettes and Frankenstein it; but it works.
I'm really curious who the Q-rings really perform; would be nice if we had some data
Rick Youngblood
CarbonCraft Master
FD is in fact the
FD is in fact the braze-on.
As far as rub, were talking on the side of the front derailleur, correct, and not the bottom black thingy? I have no rub on the bottom of the FD cage at all.
As far as extreme cross chaining, I have the FD setup so the chain will slightly rub the left side of the FD when on the largest tooth cogs when in 53t chainring and when on the 34t chainring running the smallest tooth cogs the right side of the FR.
Q-rings, I absolutely have no to data. But I feel like they power up so much faster than round rings. And I also feel that I can sprint faster too. I don't like riding without them, and won't. I've been using them on all my bike for three years now. They have the new QXL rings out now, I've heard good reviews about, I'm wanting to try them out, if only I can stop buying bikes.
FD is in fact the braze-on.
As far as rub, were talking on the side of the front derailleur, correct, and not the bottom black thingy? I have no rub on the bottom of the FD cage at all.
As far as extreme cross chaining, I have the FD setup so the chain will slightly rub the left side of the FD when on the largest tooth cogs when in 53t chainring and when on the 34t chainring running the smallest tooth cogs the right side of the FR.
Q-rings, I absolutely have no to data. But I feel like they power up so much faster than round rings. And I also feel that I can sprint faster too. I don't like riding without them, and won't. I've been using them on all my bike for three years now. They have the new QXL rings out now, I've heard good reviews about, I'm wanting to try them out, if only I can stop buying bikes.
Rick Youngblood
CarbonCraft Master
I always run 165mm.
I always run 165mm.
I always run 165mm.
Eric Winn
Zen MBB Master
Here is my Vendetta gearing
Here is my Vendetta gearing on Mike Sherman's Gear Calculator.
SRAM Rival road 53x39 cranks and SRAM mtb 11-36 cassette using SRAM Rival 170mm cranks and a SRAM mtb X9 TYPE 2 medium cage rear derailleur. Bullhorn handlebars with bar end shifters. Note the mix of road and mtb requires an inline RD adjuster.
I HIGHLY, HIGHLY recommend getting an RD with a cage lock. Makes removing and re-installing the drive wheel a great deal easier...
-Eric
Here is my Vendetta gearing on Mike Sherman's Gear Calculator.
SRAM Rival road 53x39 cranks and SRAM mtb 11-36 cassette using SRAM Rival 170mm cranks and a SRAM mtb X9 TYPE 2 medium cage rear derailleur. Bullhorn handlebars with bar end shifters. Note the mix of road and mtb requires an inline RD adjuster.
I HIGHLY, HIGHLY recommend getting an RD with a cage lock. Makes removing and re-installing the drive wheel a great deal easier...
-Eric
Rick Youngblood
CarbonCraft Master
I HIGHLY, HIGHLY recommend
I need to put that on my wish list .
I need to put that on my wish list .
ratz
Wielder of the Rubber Mallet
Removing the wheel....
I think I need to go back to the front wheel thread. I learned something on the Vendetta. On the V the front assembly stays together much much better than the Silvio. I think the it falls apart in your hand very easily is much more a Silvio problem than a vendetta problem. But yes it would be nice if those cage locks became a standard issue feature.
I think I need to go back to the front wheel thread. I learned something on the Vendetta. On the V the front assembly stays together much much better than the Silvio. I think the it falls apart in your hand very easily is much more a Silvio problem than a vendetta problem. But yes it would be nice if those cage locks became a standard issue feature.
ratz
Wielder of the Rubber Mallet
Well by data, something that
Well by data, something that shows how they work for a given riding on the platform. Compared to round.
They claim "Studies have found that the Q-Rings provide a 3% increase in max wattage, a lower heart rate of 3-4 bpm, and ultimately a 9% decrease in Lactic Acid concentration. Additionally the Q-Rings provide a noticeable decrease in patella (knee) joint pressure for those cyclists with recurring knee injuries."
But at $259 for a BCD110 52/34 or 52/36 it would be nice to quantify it. I'm no power house any more in my late forties I see that in my heart rate. I've lost 20 beats off my high end already. So as power drops especially after 50 I'm am interested in things that let maximize what is left. For me it's not really bout going faster; it's about going farther for less input energy.
Well by data, something that shows how they work for a given riding on the platform. Compared to round.
They claim "Studies have found that the Q-Rings provide a 3% increase in max wattage, a lower heart rate of 3-4 bpm, and ultimately a 9% decrease in Lactic Acid concentration. Additionally the Q-Rings provide a noticeable decrease in patella (knee) joint pressure for those cyclists with recurring knee injuries."
But at $259 for a BCD110 52/34 or 52/36 it would be nice to quantify it. I'm no power house any more in my late forties I see that in my heart rate. I've lost 20 beats off my high end already. So as power drops especially after 50 I'm am interested in things that let maximize what is left. For me it's not really bout going faster; it's about going farther for less input energy.
Rick Youngblood
CarbonCraft Master
I'm no power house any more
Well said Bob, you hit it on the head for me too . I bought mine one at a time to help ease the cost.
Using them, I feel like I can go to the next smaller cog, using the same amount of energy or force.
Like I said earlier, I have no hard data, it's just a seat of my pants feeling, therefore for me I believe in them. Placebo, maybe not.
Well said Bob, you hit it on the head for me too . I bought mine one at a time to help ease the cost.
Using them, I feel like I can go to the next smaller cog, using the same amount of energy or force.
Like I said earlier, I have no hard data, it's just a seat of my pants feeling, therefore for me I believe in them. Placebo, maybe not.
Lief
Guru Schmuru
I'm too Apples to Oranges
My comparison (Silvio 1.0 on Round rings to Vendetta II on QRings) is well...let's just say that any difference between the rings is overshadowed by a couple of other much more profound factors.
I am having some unusual, for me, front knee pain - I've been blaming it on too-short boom (both platforms) so I'm extending those just a bit.
I hadn't thought about the positives/negatives related to QRings and patella pain.
I'm going to have to worry about that arrangement (where the cranks go on the stroke) next.
Thanks.
My comparison (Silvio 1.0 on Round rings to Vendetta II on QRings) is well...let's just say that any difference between the rings is overshadowed by a couple of other much more profound factors.
I am having some unusual, for me, front knee pain - I've been blaming it on too-short boom (both platforms) so I'm extending those just a bit.
I hadn't thought about the positives/negatives related to QRings and patella pain.
I'm going to have to worry about that arrangement (where the cranks go on the stroke) next.
Thanks.
Rick Youngblood
CarbonCraft Master
I am having some unusual, for
Sorry to hear about your knee pain. Try moving the boom out in 1/8" increments. Or move it way out, and then back until you feel your leg is not over extending, and then from there again in small 1/8" increments until pain is not evident. Also, unless your are a tall guy like 6'4", your cranks seem long at 172.5mm. Try may try something in the rang of 165mm.
Sorry to hear about your knee pain. Try moving the boom out in 1/8" increments. Or move it way out, and then back until you feel your leg is not over extending, and then from there again in small 1/8" increments until pain is not evident. Also, unless your are a tall guy like 6'4", your cranks seem long at 172.5mm. Try may try something in the rang of 165mm.
ratz
Wielder of the Rubber Mallet
Mooohahahaha
I'm going to dress up as father time riding a rusty bike to Eric's house for Halloween..... I got that rusty Quest V1 maybe I should let it get good and nasty.
Faster and Farther probably no doubt; what's this training you speak of? I ride so I can eat Ben and Jerry's every day. But I'll admit I'm a better fox than a rabbit. I need something to chase.
In all seriousness though I do worry about the drop off. Pre-crash my max heart rate climbing on a DF was about 192 and I could hold the pace on the hill at 185; above that I'd pop and go backwards. On the bents I'm topping out at 171 and can hold 165 before I pop. That's big drop off in 5 years. Some of that is training; I'm in average fitness right now; with a good schedule I could improve that; but there's no way I'm getting back to 192. Interesting resting HR is still in the 55 range after all these years; big pump in this barrel chest. Blood pressure is good to low; so Doc says welcome to late 40's; get us to it. So if that's going be the case, I'm looking for ways to improve efficiency, 1% who cares but 3-4% ok that's interesting. I'm also interested in the knee part too; I got a lot of miles on mine and I thought I finally wrecked them this spring; turned out to be bad choice in pedals; and that's gone now.
I'm going to dress up as father time riding a rusty bike to Eric's house for Halloween.....
I got that rusty Quest V1 maybe I should let it get good and nasty. Faster and Farther probably no doubt; what's this training you speak of? I ride so I can eat Ben and Jerry's every day.
But I'll admit I'm a better fox than a rabbit. I need something to chase. In all seriousness though I do worry about the drop off. Pre-crash my max heart rate climbing on a DF was about 192 and I could hold the pace on the hill at 185; above that I'd pop and go backwards. On the bents I'm topping out at 171 and can hold 165 before I pop. That's big drop off in 5 years. Some of that is training; I'm in average fitness right now; with a good schedule I could improve that; but there's no way I'm getting back to 192. Interesting resting HR is still in the 55 range after all these years; big pump in this barrel chest. Blood pressure is good to low; so Doc says welcome to late 40's; get us to it. So if that's going be the case, I'm looking for ways to improve efficiency, 1% who cares but 3-4% ok that's interesting. I'm also interested in the knee part too; I got a lot of miles on mine and I thought I finally wrecked them this spring; turned out to be bad choice in pedals; and that's gone now.
I have been testing a 50/34
I have been testing a 50/34 and an 11-40 T cassette on the Vendetta and it is awesome as a bail out gear or for when you just want to spin a higher cadence on milder climbs in the big chainring. It is the One-Up Components 40T add on for the cassette.
As long as I can stay upright I can keep going, even in the 34/40 combo. That combo is a bit extreme but I get inquiries on this add-on so figured I would try it out. They sell a 42T but that is a bit too much IMHO and I am not sure how well that would shift. I can run every combo with the X0 T2 long cage DR.
These bike really like to be in the bigger chainrings in my experience.
The One-Up 40T with a 39/53 crankset would be the bees knees for lots of climbing gears plus some good end on the speed side.
Robert
I have been testing a 50/34 and an 11-40 T cassette on the Vendetta and it is awesome as a bail out gear or for when you just want to spin a higher cadence on milder climbs in the big chainring. It is the One-Up Components 40T add on for the cassette.
As long as I can stay upright I can keep going, even in the 34/40 combo. That combo is a bit extreme but I get inquiries on this add-on so figured I would try it out. They sell a 42T but that is a bit too much IMHO and I am not sure how well that would shift. I can run every combo with the X0 T2 long cage DR.
These bike really like to be in the bigger chainrings in my experience.
The One-Up 40T with a 39/53 crankset would be the bees knees for lots of climbing gears plus some good end on the speed side.
Robert
LarryOz
Cruzeum Curator & Sigma Wrangler
Heart rates and the definition fo "old"
My 2 cents:
I am 54.
I have only been riding my Silvio just over 5 weeks on the open road now (not counting the week I just came home from work and road around my subdivision because I did not trust myself not to swoop into a car going by! haha), but I have noticed that I can't seem to hit as hi of bpm as I could 2 months ago on my DF. And if anything I am probably in better shape now. I could ride my DF and average 155+ (for say 2 hours), with max at 185, and keep it around 170 on long hill climbs. I have yet been able to do that on my Silvio. Granted my average speed it much faster.
The other day, I tried to go just as hard as I could for an hour. I only averaged 149, and max'd at 172 (although I did not try for a top end, just sustained speed).
I know it sounds kind of crazy, but is it possible that the recumbent position on bike just does not allow you to push yourself as hard? (Grasping at straws possibly???)
The only other thing I can think of, is that for me, I might be subconsciously holding back because I am not 100% comfortable on the bike yet. (i.e. on a DF I could be totally drained and cross-eyed but still ride a pretty straight line, whereas on the Silvio I would not trust myself to hold a line. (especially if I have to scratch something!!!) Maybe after 20 years on a Cruzbike I'll be able to scratch and ride - who knows - then I would be 74 though? Aurg.. Isn't it amazing how the definition of old seem to change as we get "old"er?
?..
I guess my definition of "old" is: Someone that is at least 25 years older than me. My grandmother is "old", she turned 100 in May! I guess with that definition, the older you get, the less "old" people there are around.
..
With that I will go and ride some hills on my DF this afternoon just for fun. My Silvio is half apart in Gary's (BentAero's) garage - we will install the chainstay extension and hopefully do some adjusting so my knee angle is greater than 60 degrees! Can't wait!
My 2 cents:
I am 54.
I have only been riding my Silvio just over 5 weeks on the open road now (not counting the week I just came home from work and road around my subdivision because I did not trust myself not to swoop into a car going by! haha), but I have noticed that I can't seem to hit as hi of bpm as I could 2 months ago on my DF. And if anything I am probably in better shape now. I could ride my DF and average 155+ (for say 2 hours), with max at 185, and keep it around 170 on long hill climbs. I have yet been able to do that on my Silvio. Granted my average speed it much faster.
The other day, I tried to go just as hard as I could for an hour. I only averaged 149, and max'd at 172 (although I did not try for a top end, just sustained speed).
I know it sounds kind of crazy, but is it possible that the recumbent position on bike just does not allow you to push yourself as hard? (Grasping at straws possibly???)
The only other thing I can think of, is that for me, I might be subconsciously holding back because I am not 100% comfortable on the bike yet. (i.e. on a DF I could be totally drained and cross-eyed but still ride a pretty straight line, whereas on the Silvio I would not trust myself to hold a line. (especially if I have to scratch something!!!) Maybe after 20 years on a Cruzbike I'll be able to scratch and ride - who knows - then I would be 74 though? Aurg.. Isn't it amazing how the definition of old seem to change as we get "old"er?
?..
I guess my definition of "old" is: Someone that is at least 25 years older than me. My grandmother is "old", she turned 100 in May! I guess with that definition, the older you get, the less "old" people there are around.
..
With that I will go and ride some hills on my DF this afternoon just for fun. My Silvio is half apart in Gary's (BentAero's) garage - we will install the chainstay extension and hopefully do some adjusting so my knee angle is greater than 60 degrees! Can't wait!
