Beginners Pedaling Stroke
- Thread starter ratz
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ratz
Wielder of the Rubber Mallet
Things to check.
1) Use a small gear; not a big one.
2) Do not look at your feet look at the horizon.
3) Make sure your shoulders are loose
4) Make sure you are not clenching your teeth
When people really struggle I make them go back and coast feet on the pedal and make them try to steer the bike by side loading the pedals with there feet (no pedaling). It's quite hard to steer the bikes with just your feet and your brain needs to comprehend that. 90-95% of the steering input comes from leaning (true of all bike) and over correcting for the phantom expectation of steering impetuous from the feet. I sometime take video if the person doesn't believe me, and then I can show them how much the turned their arms or leaned.
Lastly if you struggle stay patient and do it in shorter batches the brain needs some time to process the new data.
If you continue to struggle you can "pull" on the hand opposite your pressing foot, that's a last resort as it takes a longer time to then unlearn that; it also makes for a very "tense' riding experience. But if you can use as a crutch to get going long enough to then practice relaxing, it might help you bridge past the problems.
1happyreader
zen/child method
wow you have put in a LOT of work with not much joy.
,,, I think you might have put the cart before the horse, glossed over the coasting in a straight line and raising your feet to the pedals and learning to pedal steps.
I treated my sofrider like I was eight , I had to feel what the bike was doing what it wanted to do.
All I had was page 13 ?? of the user manual and Jim Parker on YouTube.
I coasted in a straight line, wow,, heavy front end,, weird.
again I coasted, and when I first put my feet on the pedals the funny heavy front end disappeared and I was coasting on a bike.
and again,, OK maybe I leaned and swooped and started to smile.
coasted and gently I felt how the pedals turned without torque .
How it felt once I slowed down enough to apply force to the wheel.
stopped the bike , turned around , did it again.
Soon there was enough speed I coasted thru a big wide turn and managed to ease into pedaling again. whoo hoo now lets see about changing
which way I turned.
My first (cough) figure eights covered the length of the parking lot 150 - 200 feet.
But I was RIDING. now all I had to do was shrink the turning radius
shrink, shrink, try faster, try slower, try leaning, shrink shrink.
There is no reason to remember but as children we wobbled in spits and spurts and smiled cuz learning something new is fun.
we also ran into the lawn , in my case a wall , as we attempted many loose arcs we called turns,
keep your chin up (really aim for the horizon) ,,,, and smile
ratz
Wielder of the Rubber Mallet
At least a wall is big. I hit a telephone pole. Mom still says I did it to punish her for lying to me that she was holding the bike. Yo Mom's tell the kids how the brakes work before you let go of the bike.
SkipB we got your back kept practicing and keep asking. lotta people her to make sure you succeed. We've all been at the What Have I Done stage of the learning.
castlerobber
Zen MBB Master
I didn't have quite as hard a time learning to ride my smaller-wheeled Q--I was able to pedal it the first day--but I was by no means a natural. It took a good 3 weeks before I was willing to try riding outside a parking lot.
How much travel do you feel in the rear shock when you sit on the seat and bounce? If it's a lot, stiffening the shock up may help the handling. My Q is much more stable that way.
http://cruzbike.com/forum/threads/stiffening-the-rear-shock-quest-v3.8002/
http://cruzbike.com/forum/threads/quest-rear-shock-is-it-broken-defective.5867/
Also check that there are no obviously loose parts such as the handlebar mast, stem, or headset, or the seat back and seat pan, and that the seat back is fairly upright.
ratz
Wielder of the Rubber Mallet
That's a good point. We use 43 degrees on the teaching bikes; that seems to be the sweet spot for most beginners.
We have 3 beginners coming this weekend; with there permission we'll get some video shot so people can see how we progress them through the session.
SamP
Guru
Excellent point. When I was starting out, I was having problems with the handlebar rotating under stress (basically when I was climbing a neighborhood hill I was pulling on the bars pretty hard). It turns out the steerer riser clamp wasn't tight. I kept on checking the stem clamp but it was the whole riser tube that was rotating on me.
Balor
Zen MBB Master
Btw, I have a Zockra-ish FWD MBB, rear-suspended, but with head tube angle of 65 instead of 55, so closer to Cruzbike.
Took me a few days to learn to ride properly, a few more to master.
My girlfriend just sat and off she went. And a few hours she was manoeuvring like on her MTB and riding with me on forest paths.
I guess some are just talented. And LACK of recumbent familiarity might actually be a bonus, no skills to unlearn.
Took me a few days to learn to ride properly, a few more to master.
My girlfriend just sat and off she went. And a few hours she was manoeuvring like on her MTB and riding with me on forest paths.
I guess some are just talented. And LACK of recumbent familiarity might actually be a bonus, no skills to unlearn.
skipB
Member
all right guys . it ain't great but it is coming along . I wasn't prepared for how much my shoulders would ache after traveling a whole mile . yea just one mile . since the last entry ,the training routine has been an hour a day of Flintstone , pedal tease , and an attempt at pedaling . in the last week I have had a little success not crashing when I attempt to pedal , in the last 3 days I actually rode it in a straight line ( just luck) for about 100 yds. I have had to tighten the handle bars after almost every ride . this morning I managed to ride wobbling down my 1/4 mile long driveway . Had to take my feet off the pedals to avoid crashing three time. If the bike really swerves( it has a mind of it's own) I can not avoid putting my feet down to avoid injury . I do better when I am looking at the horizon but I fight this bike every time I try to pedal . all advice is accepted.
Robert O
Well-Known Member
I recently figured out that it takes a lot less steering input from my upper body to keep the bike straight than I thought. About two weeks into my transition onto the V20, I tried to ride my RWD high racer. I wobbled down the block for 50 yards, and gave up. That was four months ago. Yesterday, I tried it again. Just a little wobble, no problem. When I started out on the V20, I was muscling the steering around. Now, it's become really subtle; it doesn't take that much work to compensate for the pedal-induced inputs. I guess that translates into "take it easy".
castlerobber
Zen MBB Master
Can you post a picture or two, taken from the side, of you riding? Not just sitting on the bike, but actually in motion.
Emeljay
WiskersBlowinInTheWind
skipB-when you say you tighten the handlebars after rides, what exactly are you tightening? Stem clamp to handlebars, stem clamp on the riser tube, fork tube clamp on the bottom of the riser tube, Diatech adjusting screw (is headset loose/rattling?), or something else (name it)?
ratz
Wielder of the Rubber Mallet
Let see Skip, that's a Q559. So a couple of things
First of glad to see you are sticking with it; it will come...
1) Make sure the front tire is firmly inflated. A low pressure tire when you are first learning it a really bad thing so rule that out. If it drops below a certain point the front end will get squirrely and unmanageable for a new rider. (honestly that's one that still freaks me out after 10k miles)
2) Raise your seat so it's at 53-43 degrees the more upright the easier it is to learn even if you have recumbent experience. Position the bottom seat pan on the middle setting or the way forward setting if you can. You can change it later to suit your height if that's too short. That helps keep your weight forward.
3) Lengthen the boom just a bit to keep the feet lower if you can.
4) When practicing; ride with your hands Open and only Push on the handle bars don't actually grip the handle bars, it sounds like you might be death gripping and pulling far too much based on the wobbles and having to re-adjust the bars all the time. (this is very common). Open the hands only push; and relax the shoulders they are probably creeping up towards your ears.
5) Be sure to find a slight down hill and repeat the drill where you don't pedal and you try to steer just by using side pressure on your feet. Don't use a leg push; use a foot drag. If you are standing on a beach and drew a line in the sand with your big toe from straight ahead to the left or the right 2 inches, that's the motion you want. Do that same motion on the pedals. You should find it's almost impossible to steer with way the bike will turn only a little bit or not at all. It's very likely your brain hasn't accepted that fact yet and that drill will help it learn. If you can steer the bike that way you are contorting your leg in a way that you wont' when you are pedaling. The goal her is to learn that "normal" motions don't steer the bike. Until you reflexes start to understand that you feet aren't really causing much input, you will actually continue to correct way too much on the handlebars; and that hand correction is where 90-95% of the unsuitability comes from. We sometime use a camera to fill people so I can show them how much they are pulling; the flexed bicep (arms like Arnold) is the dead give away.
First of glad to see you are sticking with it; it will come...
1) Make sure the front tire is firmly inflated. A low pressure tire when you are first learning it a really bad thing so rule that out. If it drops below a certain point the front end will get squirrely and unmanageable for a new rider. (honestly that's one that still freaks me out after 10k miles)
2) Raise your seat so it's at 53-43 degrees the more upright the easier it is to learn even if you have recumbent experience. Position the bottom seat pan on the middle setting or the way forward setting if you can. You can change it later to suit your height if that's too short. That helps keep your weight forward.
3) Lengthen the boom just a bit to keep the feet lower if you can.
4) When practicing; ride with your hands Open and only Push on the handle bars don't actually grip the handle bars, it sounds like you might be death gripping and pulling far too much based on the wobbles and having to re-adjust the bars all the time. (this is very common). Open the hands only push; and relax the shoulders they are probably creeping up towards your ears.
5) Be sure to find a slight down hill and repeat the drill where you don't pedal and you try to steer just by using side pressure on your feet. Don't use a leg push; use a foot drag. If you are standing on a beach and drew a line in the sand with your big toe from straight ahead to the left or the right 2 inches, that's the motion you want. Do that same motion on the pedals. You should find it's almost impossible to steer with way the bike will turn only a little bit or not at all. It's very likely your brain hasn't accepted that fact yet and that drill will help it learn. If you can steer the bike that way you are contorting your leg in a way that you wont' when you are pedaling. The goal her is to learn that "normal" motions don't steer the bike. Until you reflexes start to understand that you feet aren't really causing much input, you will actually continue to correct way too much on the handlebars; and that hand correction is where 90-95% of the unsuitability comes from. We sometime use a camera to fill people so I can show them how much they are pulling; the flexed bicep (arms like Arnold) is the dead give away.
skipB
Member
I will try to get some video of my riding . My biceps are killing me in a mile (ridden in quarter mile increments no less). I am twisting the the handlebars off the bike. And when this thing takes off to the right or left god luck saving it .. good thing I still have good knees. when trying to ride open handed palm only I find myself pushing my shoulders hard back into the seat . so hard in fact I have to stop because my shoulder ache.. But I am nothing if not tenacious . Ratz I have really taken all of the advice very seriously . I have been keeping the sessions relatively short just to build that set of skills slowly . I do better when I am looking up instead of in the cockpit but this is really taking time . you can be sure I won't be off my driveway for a good while
ratz
Wielder of the Rubber Mallet
Alright A+ for determination. 
Let us know what we can do to help even if it's just so you can vent. Even A picture to start of you on the bike from the side would give everyone here a good reference point; and we might spot some tips. Definitely don't look at your feet as you figured out the horizon is your friend.
Can I ask what gear you are practicing in? I have most people start with the Dual drive in the middle setting; and Gear 4. Really strong people I might even back off to low on the dual drive; so they don't have so much resistance that the wheel flops.
Let us know what we can do to help even if it's just so you can vent. Even A picture to start of you on the bike from the side would give everyone here a good reference point; and we might spot some tips. Definitely don't look at your feet as you figured out the horizon is your friend.Can I ask what gear you are practicing in? I have most people start with the Dual drive in the middle setting; and Gear 4. Really strong people I might even back off to low on the dual drive; so they don't have so much resistance that the wheel flops.
Emeljay
WiskersBlowinInTheWind
If you are twisting the handlebars at the stem then it sounds like you need to relax (or your stem at the handlebars bolts are not tight enough, but don't tighten them more than firmly or they may strip).
Follow ratz steps, especially starting on slight down incline by flintstoning and just keep feet (off pedals) slightly downposition while coasting. And be relaxed especially back shoulder arms and only LIGHTLY gripping handlebars (or palming bars), going slow in straight line. Then stop slowly, put feet on ground. Walk bike back up incline and do this again at least several times until you are feeling comfortably not wobbly.
You need to feel comfortable with the FWD just coasting all the while relaxed before even putting your feet on the pedals coasting, and even before pedalling lightly, etc. Remember you are training your brain-muscle coordination with the FWD in steps as is outlined on the home page 'learning to ride'.
Follow ratz steps, especially starting on slight down incline by flintstoning and just keep feet (off pedals) slightly downposition while coasting. And be relaxed especially back shoulder arms and only LIGHTLY gripping handlebars (or palming bars), going slow in straight line. Then stop slowly, put feet on ground. Walk bike back up incline and do this again at least several times until you are feeling comfortably not wobbly.
You need to feel comfortable with the FWD just coasting all the while relaxed before even putting your feet on the pedals coasting, and even before pedalling lightly, etc. Remember you are training your brain-muscle coordination with the FWD in steps as is outlined on the home page 'learning to ride'.
