Bullhorn and Dropbar Options

[Alan Clucas]

Thanks Kline, that looks good. I like your solution to the shifter cables, although I had always assumed bar end shifters allowed the cable to run down inside the bar... I guess I'm wrong there!

I'm not so sure about inverted brake levers though. I'm used to braking with 1 or 2 fingers (from mountain biking) and in that configuration you're just using the weaker fingers. My V has discs, and if I was going to do this was I'd probably fit hydraulic brakes and levers. I did try them that way up on the deda elementi, but didn't feel comfy, and the levers stuck out more than yours. I have some alternative (non brifter) levers which might work better, I'll experiment with them.

 

[ReklinedRider]

Looking good Reklined Rider
Can you tell me what those bags are under the seat of the soft rider ?
Rob

Thanks, Bentas, those are Radical Design Solo Racer bags (wide). You can see another post on this forum from awhile back, just search 'underseat location for Radical Design Solo Racer wide bags' and it will come up. Wish I could get the link for you but the search is easy. That post by BobD is where I got the idea.

 

[ReklinedRider]

Thanks Kline, that looks good. I like your solution to the shifter cables, although I had always assumed bar end shifters allowed the cable to run down inside the bar... I guess I'm wrong there!

I'm not so sure about inverted brake levers though. I'm used to braking with 1 or 2 fingers (from mountain biking) and in that configuration you're just using the weaker fingers. My V has discs, and if I was going to do this was I'd probably fit hydraulic brakes and levers. I did try them that way up on the deda elementi, but didn't feel comfy, and the levers stuck out more than yours. I have some alternative (non brifter) levers which might work better, I'll experiment with them.

Thanks Alan. Yeah I wish the bar end shifters ran inside the bar; if they did I would drill out holes for them to exit (in a plane at right angles to the main push/pull vector). The bullhorn bar that John Tolhurst introduced for Vendetta was my inspiration for this goofiness which I found I liked enough to go no further in a search for a bullhorn bar. On his bar he also offered bar end shifters configured to run inside the bar. Ratz came up with a very clever way to reconfigure SRAM bar ends to run inside the bar too but if I recall correctly it was not for R2C; I like the R2c enough to put up with the shifter housings outside the bar. (It helped that I found brand new R2C shifters on ebay for $100 instead of the retail price of $350!)

The inverted levers are positioned so that I can very easily use all four fingers from any hand position except the shoulders/flats of the bar of course, even though I frequently do use just the weaker two, since the rear brake is a Paul v-brake and very powerful esp w short-pull brake levers, and the front is a TRP road disc brake. It is not hydraulic but is plenty of brake; I put Jagwire compressionless brake housing front and rear which helps too.

I've put a few more pics in the thumbnails below, not only of the brake position but of the multiple hand positions, all of which are comfortable and stable, and equally useful to pull on the bars or push, even open palm style. Plus I really like my hands above the bars, not underneath as they were when the bars were mounted in a 'traditional' manner and I was using brifters. And, when I shift I feel much more stable since I don't have to take any fingers off the bar to reach for the STI or equivalent; shifting up or down in a turn under power is better with the bar ends. To me anyway. One last thing is that the curve of the bar along with the position of the hoods is good for my perhaps irrational fear of my hands sliding too far down and maybe off if I hit an unexpected rough spot (which *almost* happened once with Bacchetta tweener bars; once was enough and now I'm a little paranoid )
Sorry for rambling.

 

[ratz]

Ratz came up with a very clever way to reconfigure SRAM bar ends to run inside the bar too but if I recall correctly it was not for R2C;

Correct if you have R2C don't try modifying them. It won't work; and for the price of them you can afforad Di2 at that point IF you are starting with a groupset purchase from scratch. All the other SRAM bar ends can be modified per my instructions.

If and when I upgrade our quests this handle bar setup is on my list of things to try. It looks like it would be good for the my bigger legs.

 

[Aggieray74]

I have a Silvio 2.0 that I purchased almost 2 yrs. ago. At that time I also bought a cruzbike bullhorn bar. Being a nubie, I had Richardson Bike Mart assemble the bike. They said the bullhorn bar could not be used with my DI2 shifter. I still have the bullhorn bar and would like to try it. My arms get uncomfortable in a bent position. Any ideas why it would not work?

 

[DavidCH]

Odds and ends that got left on the cutting room floor.

Couple of odds and ends that never got posted.


Caged animals ready to run. To keep junior cruzbikers off them you some ties have to be creative.

Sometimes we ride blind in areas unfamiliar to us by map. Needed a way to have the giganto phone more accessible in the cockpit. MN is notorious for the unlabeled gravel road. So a premade cut sheet can leave you hanging. A real time map is handy... So add this light weight carbon post. Only weigh 2oz and is $14 from amazon.

Works underneath the boom

And above the boom

Then mount the airbrake known a iphone battery powered case. Man those things are large.

Not something I would ride with daily; but if running a technical and unfamiliar course with lots of turns; the penalty will be worth it to have a real time map course up.

This last picture has that wonderful cyclometer that has me itching to buy, how did you mount it and what's the battery life like? I bought a small smartphone from Wal-Mart recently but haven't successfully mounted it anywhere on the V so I am thinking of getting the RFLKT and mounting it in the position just like yours.

 

[ratz]

, how did you mount it and what's the battery life like?

That's the stock mounting RFLKT bracket and 2 zip ties that it ships with.

But frankly in today's market the best bang for the dollar has to be the Garmin 520 which is only slightly more than a RFLKT and vastly superior

 

[Eric Winn]

But frankly in today's market the best bang for the dollar has to be the Garmin 520

How is the screen visibility in bright sunlight? And battery life? Will it last through a 24 hour ultra?

 

[DavidCH]

Foremost, I prefer to ride bikes than be a mechanic.

So in the picture you can see some rather snazzy 3T aero bullhorns attached to the Vendetta. I had ridden them for a few miles and decided yes… they feel GREAT with that set up. I was concerned that there might not be too much space for my knees and that the narrower the handlebar the more unstable the bike would be. However to my amazement the bike was remarkably stable and that there was enough space for my knees to with the bullhorns of length 42cm. However, I didn’t like the cables being outside of the bars.

The anguish and perseverance that went into this update was extreme. What did I learn? Probably discretion and a better understanding of what it is to be a bike mechanic.

The bullhorns come with some holes; two holes, left and right at the middle and a hole centred on top of each of the arms, obviously to run cables thru them and being a perfectionist I tried, but the fit was too tight. If I had taken the bars to a machine shop and got the middle holes on the other side of the bullhorns then undoubtedly it would have been somewhat easier to manipulate the cables. Even though the outer casing tubes wouldn’t fit, I tried mounting the Shimano 6800 brifters. Alas cables enter each dual control at the side so there was no way of fitting them on the bullhorns. I set my cycling budget to $1000 for the year and being winter it’s a good time to invest in a hobby that is so enjoyable, so I was not going out to buy a new electronic groupset or even buying different brifters, especially after buying new handlebars and crankset. As the cables in the last 18 months have been well used they didn’t last a long time before fraying. This is so irritating, trying to put a fraying cable into a small hole! I learnt a technique on the internet of using a marker pen on the end of the cable and then you superglue the cable where the mark is and cut and bingo you don’t get fraying. This actually did work but I had to go and buy some cutters, but for a good job you need good quality cutters that can handle the cable and the outer casing. It’s cheaper and easier to pop into a bike shop and buy a cable wire(s) and don’t cut until you have finished fitting them.

Then getting all the controls nearly worked. The only thing that didn’t work was the front brifter. Even with a lot of tension the brifter would not latch the cable tight. The thought of having to buy a new control because something had gone wrong with the old one which was perfectly good two days ago… so weird. But I found out what it was after having to pull out the front gear cable again. Only by pulling out the cable did the brifter reset itself. The new cable had a slightly different sized head to it and you have to be ever so careful to engage it into the brifter’s housing; only then does it engage the cable. So everything is back together.

The bullhorns are very aero and I decided to keep them aero by using an old inner-tube for each of the arms. If you buy special handlebar tape, you are only going to use a little so I couldn’t see the point in it. Perhaps later I can buy if it presents itself as an issue.

 

[Apollo]

DavidCH, nice bar setup! Which 3T model are these bullhorns, and how do you find the new bars in relation to the number of hand positions compared to your older bars? I'm also thinking about a bullhorn brifter arrangement because it opens up the selection of bars without as much worry for width. The only thing that is an issue is neat cable management, as you noted. It seems more and more CB owners are adopting this setup or thinking about it.

 

[DavidCH]

I have just two hand positions at the moment, I guess I could actually hold on to the aero bits between the arms but I don't feel confident to do that at 30mph. I bought the aerobars from chainreactioncycles. 3T do a newer version now, this was old stock and I got it for 50%discount which worked out at around 70 euros. So position 1 is straight arms with hands over the brifters and position 2 is hands around the brifters with index finger out. Here I have the brifters pointing in, on the road I had to adjust them so they are pointing out a little in order to stop the levers hitting the knees.

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/es/en/3t-vola-pro-basebar/rp-prod122919

Well for me it is early days still. I was using before the handlebars that came with the Vendetta which were 57cm wide so there is quite a huge difference. I enjoyed 3 hand positions with the stock bars as they had drops. With these I feel a little limited simply because they are so narrow. But I do notice that the bike is faster.

 

[DavidCH]

How is the screen visibility in bright sunlight? And battery life? Will it last through a 24 hour ultra?

The Wahoo RFLKT battery last for a year but an iPhone only lasts for 10 hours. I bought a cheap LG android smartphone from Wal-Mart for $10 and it lasts for 3 days (but haven't tried a 24 hour). I did actually buy 2 smartphones for $20 so I can change the battery in one with the other as well as having a hot-spare. So I think it might be feasible except you can't see the display at night. Bright sunlight is not a problem. One other issue I noticed, Wahoo support more the iPhone version of firmware more than android, so the screen freezes 1 in 3 trips and so you have to reset it by pressing two buttons. Its early days yet. I love it because its small and doesn't obscure my view. It doesn't have GPS or any great features. I wanted it to monitor my heart rate when in combat mode as sometimes it feels I'm going to burst a blood vessel. I also think its important to monitor the cadence rate. My mountain bike doesn't really need it but I find myself more in the anaerobic zone with the V.

 

[SamP]

Many Sony and Samsung phones support ANT+, so you can have a bike computer with heart rate, speed, cadence, and power sensor support just by loading an app. Phones though tend to be a lot larger than bike computers with much worse battery life though--on the other hand, you probably already have a phone and a good bike computer app is pretty cheap.

 

[1happyreader]

Going 4 economy I got ANT+ heart, cadence, and speed sensors paired with a Cateye Stealth 50 Cycling Computer.
Data transfer and battery recharge are thru a USB cradle.
and the sensors are in place if I get Garmin fever.

later,,, bye

 

[DavidCH]

That's a great discount but my Jabra pulse earbuds aren't Ant+ and I wont wear a heart rate belt or strap on my wrist. Guess that film "The Green Mile" had something to do with it. LOL

Apparently http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...e=as2&tag=thviofli-20&linkId=XJDQFSFXJEEACZVB this product (wrist band) has greater accuracy that is Ant+

 

[1happyreader]

My wife Marie was NOT interested in a chest strap so we got a Scosche Rhythm armband for her.
Running endomundo and Scosche heartrate at the same time did not work.
Every time she checked her gps speed app the heartrate app stopped.
Not sure if we tried MapMyRide or not. Should try again with her new phone.
A Fitbit lives on her wrist now.
later,,,,,,,,,, bye

 

[Eric Winn]

The Wahoo RFLKT battery last for a year but an iPhone only lasts for 10 hours. I bought a cheap LG android smartphone from Wal-Mart for $10 and it lasts for 3 days (but haven't tried a 24 hour). I did actually buy 2 smartphones for $20 so I can change the battery in one with the other as well as having a hot-spare. So I think it might be feasible except you can't see the display at night. Bright sunlight is not a problem. One other issue I noticed, Wahoo support more the iPhone version of firmware more than android, so the screen freezes 1 in 3 trips and so you have to reset it by pressing two buttons. Its early days yet. I love it because its small and doesn't obscure my view. It doesn't have GPS or any great features. I wanted it to monitor my heart rate when in combat mode as sometimes it feels I'm going to burst a blood vessel. I also think its important to monitor the cadence rate. My mountain bike doesn't really need it but I find myself more in the anaerobic zone with the V.

Yeah, I have a RFLKT and a RFLKT+ and an iPhone that I've used in some 24 hour ultras. I was asking about Bob's Garmin 520 recommendation. Bob has, or had a RFLKT too IIRC.

 

[ratz]

Yeah, I have a RFLKT and a RFLKT+ and an iPhone that I've used in some 24 hour ultras. I was asking about Bob's Garmin 520 recommendation. Bob has, or had a RFLKT too IIRC.

Oh I missed that. My RFLKT and RFLKT+ pretty much are used by the kids these days. We pretty much use our Garmin 1000's all the time now; plenty of battery life and the back light is great. Since the 520 is basically the same unit but small and a lot cheaper I figure it is going to own the market for a while. Battery life for ultra just use those great cylinder batteries the larry found.

 

[ratz]

Ok updating the forever thread.

I promised some info based on the testing of new handle bars on during the V20 build. Here's the summary info pictures to follow.

We tested:

Bullhorn brifters
Midge on-one
Salsa Woodchipper
Salsa Cowchipper 2
Legacy Gary Bars

We combined that with the Straight Slider and the Curved Slider; we tested it with the Slammed stem and the normal stem.

That was a lot of combos; and I didn't do the best job photographing it; it sort of went fast and it's hard to get good shots of them on the bike. Here are the key findings.

1) The height of the handle bars still has a lot to do with the bar selection

2) I'm 5'9" 170lbs headed back to 155 from 200+. I can

a) Ride the Straight Slider on and uncut (unslammed) stem, if the bars have some sort of drop to them either: traditional drops so bullhorns that have drop shoulders.
b) Ride the curved slider on the unslammed stem
c) Ride the straight slider on the slammed stem
d) I can not ride a slammed stem and a curved slider (well I can but it wouldn't really be safe there not enough room to sit up cleanly).
​

3) Pluckyblond is 5'7" of undisclosed weight but we'll call her slim. She can

a) Ride the Curved slider on an unslammed stem + bars with a drop
b) Ride Curved slider on a slammed stem with any bars
c) She can not ride comfortably with the straight slider and get two hand positions.​

4) For me I have the follow handlebar issues:

a) WoodChippers are too narrow at the bend where I want the brifters, they end up hiting my legs
b) The cowchipper2 has too little forward reach and my arms are very bent at all positions
c) Gary bars are ok just a hair narrow but I've used those a long time.
d) Bullhorn brifters work good are very low have the right reach but only one position is usable. I would use them if Time Trialing but I think I'd ditch the brifters and go with blips for shifting and TT brakes. That would be more aero.
e) The Midge on-one is perfect; hair wider than the Garybars; a little less flare out and no need to cut them. The midge can also be run in a "up" position or for TTing it can be rotated down in the way Hardy has Moose configured and get a great position for aero. This is nice as there is no bar to change out.
​

5) Pluckyblond found this:

a) Midge too much reach would have to bring the slider way back into her body for arms to reach; leading to unstable steering and trouble getting off the bike.
b) Legacy Gaybars same proble as Midge.
c) Salsa Woodchipper really good; lets her get brifters really nice and straight forward. But on the Vendetta the hands are too high. These then got move to her Silvio and they work acceptable there. (This is a concession to all the people we have come test ride; her Silvio is our last one and her Bullhorn Brifters were too compact and hard to handle for people to test ride. She prefers them; but is content with the Woodchipper because the bike pretty much lives on the trainer now Call Bullhorn Brifters Choice 1A and Woodchipper 1B.)
e) Cowchipper2 was perfect for her with the slammed stem; the short reach of the bars give her a low aero position when on the hoods; and a nice tucked power position in the drops
​

6) In the end the key items become:

a) Does the reach give you two positions on the hood aero and in the drops power
b) can the bars be positioned low enough for your shoulder
c) which way does the bend in the bar flare the brifters
e) are the bars wide enough for you legs without being too wide and providing too much leverage.
​

Conclusions:

1) The Curved slider was a great idea and it solves problems for many the smaller riders.
2) The new boom design of the V20 series solves a lot of fit problems.
3) The Midge on-one is a great bar for riders over 5'8" and up
4) The Salsa cowchipper2 is great for smaller riders with shorter arm reach
5) The Salsa woodchipper is a middle group and good if you like your hand high when on the hoods.
6) Bullhorn brifters are still good but might now be a compromise you don't have to make because of the Curved slider.


Again photos of the final results to follow.

 

[super slim]

Ok updating the forever thread.

I promised some info based on the testing of new handle bars on during the V20 build. Here's the summary info pictures to follow.

We tested:

Bullhorn brifters
Midge on-one
Salsa Woodchipper
Salsa Cowchipper 2
Legacy Gary Bars

We combined that with the Straight Slider and the Curved Slider; we tested it with the Slammed stem and the normal stem.

That was a lot of combos; and I didn't do the best job photographing it; it sort of went fast and it's hard to get good shots of them on the bike. Here are the key findings.

1) The height of the handle bars still has a lot to do with the bar selection

2) I'm 5'9" 170lbs headed back to 155 from 200+. I can

a) Ride the Straight Slider on and uncut (unslammed) stem, if the bars have some sort of drop to them either: traditional drops so bullhorns that have drop shoulders.
b) Ride the curved slider on the unslammed stem
c) Ride the straight slider on the slammed stem
d) I can not ride a slammed stem and a curved slider (well I can but it wouldn't really be safe there not enough room to sit up cleanly).
​

3) Pluckyblond is 5'7" of undisclosed weight but we'll call her slim. She can

a) Ride the Curved slider on an unslammed stem + bars with a drop
b) Ride Curved slider on a slammed stem with any bars
c) She can not ride comfortably with the straight slider and get two hand positions.​

4) For me I have the follow handlebar issues:

a) WoodChippers are too narrow at the bend where I want the brifters, they end up hiting my legs
b) The cowchipper2 has too little forward reach and my arms are very bent at all positions
c) Gary bars are ok just a hair narrow but I've used those a long time.
d) Bullhorn brifters work good are very low have the right reach but only one position is usable. I would use them if Time Trialing but I think I'd ditch the brifters and go with blips for shifting and TT brakes. That would be more aero.
e) The Midge on-one is perfect; hair wider than the Garybars; a little less flare out and no need to cut them. The midge can also be run in a "up" position or for TTing it can be rotated down in the way Hardy has Moose configured and get a great position for aero. This is nice as there is no bar to change out.
​

5) Pluckyblond found this:

a) Midge too much reach would have to bring the slider way back into her body for arms to reach; leading to unstable steering and trouble getting off the bike.
b) Legacy Gaybars same proble as Midge.
c) Salsa Woodchipper really good; lets her get brifters really nice and straight forward. But on the Vendetta the hands are too high. These then got move to her Silvio and they work acceptable there. (This is a concession to all the people we have come test ride; her Silvio is our last one and her Bullhorn Brifters were too compact and hard to handle for people to test ride. She prefers them; but is content with the Woodchipper because the bike pretty much lives on the trainer now Call Bullhorn Brifters Choice 1A and Woodchipper 1B.)
e) Cowchipper2 was perfect for her with the slammed stem; the short reach of the bars give her a low aero position when on the hoods; and a nice tucked power position in the drops
​

6) In the end the key items become:

a) Does the reach give you two positions on the hood aero and in the drops power
b) can the bars be positioned low enough for your shoulder
c) which way does the bend in the bar flare the brifters
e) are the bars wide enough for you legs without being too wide and providing too much leverage.
​

Conclusions:

1) The Curved slider was a great idea and it solves problems for many the smaller riders.
2) The new boom design of the V20 series solves a lot of fit problems.
3) The Midge on-one is a great bar for riders over 5'8" and up
4) The Salsa cowchipper2 is great for smaller riders with shorter arm reach
5) The Salsa woodchipper is a middle group and good if you like your hand high when on the hoods.
6) Bullhorn brifters are still good but might now be a compromise you don't have to make because of the Curved slider.


Again photos of the final results to follow.

What is a Slammed Stem?