Electric conversion to a Quest 451

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crazy_ebot

Active Member
So, this is one of those good news, bad news, good news, bad news stories.

The bad news is the bike isn’t currently working.
The good news is that earlier, it did work, and was awesome.
The bad news is I suspect it doesn’t currently work, because the front wheel wasn’t secure, slipped from the dropouts under torque,and jammed the wheel to the chainstay. Now, the LCD screen refuses to start up.
The good news is, until it stopped working, there didn’t seem to be any wobble in the motor, no resistance or drag in the crank or wheel, and it was dead silent at 46km (pedalling). Changes were all very smooth.

So it’s another hour plus trip to the store tomorrow.

P.S. Bret, the solarbike crew say hi. :)
 
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crazy_ebot

Active Member
I hadn’t crossed the first street. There was no crash, no damage (aside from some aspect of the electronics). Hopefully will sort out tomorrow.

Worth mentioning that the extra weight at the front of the bike made the ride stiffer, but it also settled the front. Very steady ride.
 
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crazy_ebot

Active Member
It turns out my bike is missing the SRAM dual drive anti-rotation washers... if anyone knows of a good source let me know (emailing SRAM shortly)
 
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crazy_ebot

Active Member
Okay, this time with pictures (And numbers).

It's the Solarbike rebranded Torque based mid drive in the 48v 500w version. I don't think I need the power, but I read 60 pages of forum thread a few days ago regarding this motor (The TongSheng TSDZ2), and it sounds like earlier models (250-350w) had some occassional build quality issues.

I've coupled it with a 48v, 10A Tiger Shark battery. The 451's e-ring is now sitting in a box: The new crankset has longer arms, but they also appear to be slightly more offset, which is helping with the 'heel clipping the derailleur' issue I had. The mid-drive comes with a little/compact LCD screen and a separate throttle, so I have options in case I injure my leg(s) I guess.

IMG_6281.JPG IMG_6282.JPG IMG_6283.JPG IMG_6285.JPG IMG_6286.JPG IMG_6288.JPG IMG_6290.JPG

This is compared to my rear hub config, which was: Rear Hub motor (also 500w) with a 48v, 14A battery and throttle. Shorter 155m crank arms and the e-ring. Weight was all in the rear.

I haven't ridden the mid-drive any distances yet, just a couple of trips down the street. At this early stage, I think I prefer the added weight and stiffness at the front, as it adds stability at higher speeds... but after a ride to work tomorrow I'll know if over a distance that stiffness comes at a cost to my arms and legs.

I'm worried about the lack of SRAM Anti-rotation washers (We've tightened up the washers that I do have significantly). Especially as I've just added the motor to the front. Shout out to Henry at Solarbike for spotting their absence. I suspect he's saved me a whole lot of grief.

I don't know what kind of distances a 10A battery will get me, but I can say that at the 2nd power assist setting (of 4), I could get into the 3rd gear+smallest ring and pedal (hard) at a high speed.
 
super slim

super slim

Zen MBB Master
The 500 w means that the controller, which is the most failure prone component, is only operating at 50% of its capacity.
Solar bike might have set the current limit to 18 amps to save the controller!
Remember to stop pedalling when you change gears, so no electric power through the change!
 
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crazy_ebot

Active Member
Hey bret, what's the Nuvinci hub like? I've seen them on eBay for $500(ish).

On my Elliptigo I've got a Shimano (8 speed?) internal hub, I suspect its a bit like driving an automatic car: Sure, you can drive a manual if you have to, but if you have the option, automatics are nice to drive. : )
 
super slim

super slim

Zen MBB Master
Remember that there is a delay from when you stop pedalling, to when the power stops!
That's for a cadence system!
For a torque system, just reduce the pressure on the pedals, while still pedalling, for ?? secs while changing! There will be a delay, to power reduction, so with time you will get used to the delay.
 
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bret

Well-Known Member
crazy_ebot said:
what's the Nuvinci hub like
Click to expand...

I haven't been riding much lately, and my legs aren't strong. So I don't think I have a good take on it yet.

One aspect I'm noticing a lot lately is that I'm constantly adjusting the ratio to meet the slope - the result is my right hand is not relaxed on the grip, and I tend to steer to the side because of that.

They also have a cadence controller, which I would set to what I want, and it dials the ratio for me based on keeping me on a steady cadence. I had it in mind when I bought the pieces - part of why I got the most boring manual controller (and also just how much do I want to look at the little rider on the handebar controller grip while I'm riding, after all?).

Perhaps with that cadence controller, I might not be holding my hand off, ready to dial in the ratio, and just ride. It will be several hundred dollars before I find out, so don't wait up to hear.
 
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crazy_ebot

Active Member
I need to do some reading on the Nuvinci tech: it sounds more complicated than the Shimano hub on my Elliptigo. Thanks bret.

Side note: the longer, more offset crank arms, coupled with (slightly) shortening the steering boom, appears to have put the derailleur hanger out of reach of my heel. longer crank arms = less heel contact seems counter intuitive to me... And probably transparently obvious to those mechanically minded. : )

Almost forgot: some quick figures&thoughts from this morning's ride.
  • (old) bike- Elliptigo (20” wheels), 500w Hub, 48v 14Ah battery. Over 21km (travel time: 45min), results in a recharge time of 2.5-3 hours, with a fan-based charger.
  • (new) bike- Cruzbike (20” wheels), 500w Mid-drive, 14v 10Ah battery. Over 21km (travel time: 45min), results in a recharge time of 50 minutes, with a fan-based charger.
My takeaways from this are:
  1. The Cruzbike is pretty much the opposite of the Elliptigo in terms of energy efficiency, and;
  2. My journey is as much about the time stuck at intersections as it is about pedaling.
Excellent ride in this morning. Set the power at 2 (Touring?), and rode hard (but comfortably sweaty... Though my wife may not agree). Speeds between 30km (inclines) and 47km (descents) with 40km being the average on flats. In my initial test rides, I didn't account for the extra weight from my Henty Wingman bag.

Based on the charge times above, I suspect I’ll get at least twice the distance out of my smaller battery on the cruzbike. Pretty cool.

Slim, I seem to be getting the hang of easing off whenever I change gear. Thanks for the tip. Also discovered that my hanger was bent, so a generous local Cannington bike shop (Thanks Craig!) set it (and me) straight. Fixed the rear brake, too.
 
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crazy_ebot

Active Member
IMG_6368.JPG
Version 1.2, after I discovered the new cruzbike rear rack isn’t compatible with the battery placement behind the seat.

The added weight to the front isn’t exactly welcome, but it doesn’t feel like it’s worsened the steering, and the heft at the front helps with climbing in the wet, or on loose surfaces. Maybe it is welcome. :)

The rear rack is great. Mine came sans the bolt connecting the base to the shock head, but I grabbed a high tensile bolt from Bunnings. I also now have a q559 replacement chain stay, but that’s a job for another day.

Oh, and the Ventsit seat is freaking awesome.
 
paco1961

paco1961

Zen MBB Master
crazy_ebot said:
View attachment 6595
Version 1.2, after I discovered the new cruzbike rear rack isn’t compatible with the battery placement behind the seat.

The added weight to the front isn’t exactly welcome, but it doesn’t feel like it’s worsened the steering, and the heft at the front helps with climbing in the wet, or on loose surfaces. Maybe it is welcome. :)

The rear rack is great. Mine came sans the bolt connecting the base to the shock head, but I grabbed a high tensile bolt from Bunnings. I also now have a q559 replacement chain stay, but that’s a job for another day.

Oh, and the Ventsit seat is freaking awesome.
Click to expand...
What specifically do you like about the V-sit over the stock CB seat pad?
 
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crazy_ebot

Active Member
IMG_6388.JPG IMG_6386.JPG

A couple of clearer images.

The Ventsit is great for a couple of reasons:
1. It really does seem to prevent the sweaty back issue I have when doing long rides (My daily commute is a 44km round trip).
2. Although I suspect that my original cushions were a bit squashed (the bike is second hand after all), my butt hurts less over long distances. That may change over time though.

One knock against the Ventsit is that at the moment, it can feel a little slippery at times. I suspect that will change as my posterior roughs up the outer surface.

I noticed a little extra shudder in the front today, which I'm attributing to the new battery placement. Only when pedalling hard uphill in high/mid gear though, and managable.

I could still sling the Henty bag on the right side, but that feels like a waste of the rear rack. Will see. I do know that my kids _loved_ riding on the back. The rear rack has natural 'stirrups' for their little feet, and there are plenty of bars for their hands to grip.

I was amazed at how easy it was for them to climb on with me pre-seated, and how little it affected the steering/balance, in both stationary and mobile scenarios. Fantastic 'in case of emergency, carry child' knowledge.
 
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