Fat Man on Hills

[admin]

OK, gut check time. I love my new Freerider v2, put 25 miles on it my first big ride. Easly twice the distance I could ride my Diamondback without my hands going to sleep. I'm 46 and 300 pounds. I picked up my old Diamondback over a year ago and started riding it to work. Four miles each way and about a mile of it is one long hill. Over last summer, after getting and lungs and legs into condition, I can climb the hill on my moutain bike without stopping, lost 50 lbs in the process. Bought the Freerider for more comfort and top end but I can't get it up the smallest of grades. Initially I assumed it was new bike and muscle groups to get use to; however, after having the bike for a month and slowly building up endurance I'm just putting serious stress on the drive train. I even added a second smaller front gear; but, two days ago I broke the stock chain grunting up a small slope about 200 yrds long. Climbing hill totally reminds me of doing leg presses on a machine. I gear down and spin but as soon as I lose momentum I'm pressing with everything I got. Love the bike on the flat but it just doesn't feel right or work for that matter climbing! I'm aware of the rated weight limit on the Freerider. After reading about what a great climber the bike it I'm wondering what the deal is, the weight limit, my muscles, or the bike? I'm curious if anyone else has had similar experience? Thanks, -d

 

[teacherbill]

I ride conversion with two gears and I agree about the weight machine. I have not gone over too many artificial hills (bridges in Florida) as of yet, but I expect that I might also pop a chain. I have ridden many long ascents and have been impressed with the conversion, but it isn't a Freerider . Keep up the attempts and you can cheer real loud when you crest the first time. I know I did on my OCR2 when I was riding the Sky Line Drive in Virginia a couple of years ago.

Keep peddling...

 

[trapdoor2]

It is all about the gearing...and the motor.

I'm of similar weight (sans the lost 50lbs) and ride a conversion. My neighborhood is full of short (and not so short) hills, some of which are quite steep (like 9%, not nearly world record steep but certainly sufficient to make me think I'm going to blow a gasket). I'm running a 27 speed setup (triple up front, 30-39-53 & 9sp rear with 11-32 gearing). Essentially, I can ride most of my neighborhood streets without ever using the 30 tooth ring up front...reserving it for the steep stuff.

I cannot tell if the Freerider has the gearing to attack hills...but if you're "mashing" in your lowest gear to get up moderate hills, then something ain't right! For myself, I want to be able to carry between 90 and 110 rpm cadence and be running around 5mph (minimum!) up any hill. I have found if I get that combination right (and my cardio stays below 180), I can climb pretty well.

The Cruzbike format has proven to me that a recumbent can climb. My "other" recumbent is an Optima Baron...the conversion has it beat by a long shot for climbing...and their gearing is virtually identical.

 

[JonB]

trapdoor2 wrote: I cannot tell if the Freerider has the gearing to attack hills...but if you're "mashing" in your lowest gear to get up moderate hills, then something ain't right! For myself, I want to be able to carry between 90 and 110 rpm cadence and be running around 5mph (minimum!) up any hill. I have found if I get that combination right (and my cardio stays below 180), I can climb pretty well.

If his Freerider is anything like mine it does not have the gearing for hillclimbing. My Freerider came with a single 8 derailure gears, with a 44 tooth in front, and probably a mega-range 8 in the back, is that 11-34? It was enough for the few hills in Copenhagen, but still i exchanged it for a used Rohloff which is running fine.

 

[defjack]

I would put a triple on it. Sometimes you just need that small ring for the longer steeper hills. Jack

 

[trapdoor2]

Understanding gearing is an exercise in relatively simple math. I recommend heading over to the Sheldon Brown website for some great information.

So, assuming the Freerider has a 44 up front and an 8sp "megarange" (11-34) in the rear, let's compare the lowest gearing:

Freerider 44 X 34 = 33.6 gear/in = 2.7m/106.3" 'development'
Conversion 30 X 32 = 22.9 gear/in = 1.8m/70.8" 'development'
Baron 26 X 34 = 19.9 gear/in = 1.6m/63.0" 'development'

I like "development". Basically it is the distance the bike travels with one complete revolution of the crank. You can easily see that the Freerider is travelling 40% further than the Baron per turn of the crank and 33% further than my Conversion. I can do small hills on my conversion even in the middle chain ring...which is a 39t, but to be in an equivalent gear to the lowest on the Freerider, I would need to shift up a bit! (39 X 28)...no wonder you're suffering!

 

[John Tolhurst]

One turn of the crank, yeah, but what about the crank length eh? where does that come in?

Sheldon to the rescue again, see the links on the gearing page I just renewed last night: http://www.cruzbike.com/content/gain-ratio-gearing-calculations-work-long-or-short-cranks

If crank lengths were all the same ol 170mm, then ok, but that isn't the case with our bikes. Come to think of it there is a lot of variation out there in bikes of all kinds. And that variation can be from 152 to 175 on bikes ranging from a sofrider V1 to many home built conversions. 175/152 = 1.15. Thats 15% over or understatement if you happen to be comparing gears development between one and the other. You say 110" when you meant for comparative purposes 126 or something because you didn't note the 152s.

Gain ratios need no units and a handy rule of thumb is 2 is about as low as you go and 8 is about as high as you go. That is, the bike moves at between 2 and 8 times the foot speed, just about all the time. Very nice. 2 cubed = 8. This is the kind of logic that sparks me up, anyhow - I always like those kind of simple relationships. On an unfaired bike, (2)^3 is about all you need while on a streamliner, it will look more like (2)^4.

Now on the other hand, you start talking inches development and I'm goin to have to ask, what's an inch when its at home? ;-)

 

[trapdoor2]

LOL, yes John, I'm very familiar with Sheldon's Gain Ratio. I also spend a lot of time trying to explain complex engineering stuff to 'non-engineers', feebly attempting to keep their eyes from glazing over. :lol:

You're absolutely right about crank length, etc. However, I had no data regarding the Freerider as delivered. Heck, there's nothing on the Cruzbike site about the gearing (other than it has 8 speeds) at all. I also didn't attack the wheel/tyre size differences: my Baron has a 650c drive wheel whilst my Conversion is fitted with a 26" drive wheel. Crank length between my bikes are both identical though (170mm).

And don't be going off on "inches". We all have conversion charts handy. Besides, I did provide meters.

Still, it all boils down to the OP's need for some taller gearing. If he has some mechanical aptitude, he easily install a compact double (34/50) or a MTB double (36-44) or triple (22-36-44). I imagine a 22t front X 34 rear would allow him to climb trees! :lol:

 

[admin]

Thanks for the feedback. I'll look for a smaller gear up front. -d