Gearing options for Shimano Ultegra Triple

[kenhardwick]

I have the Shimano Ultegra Triple with The triple chainring (52-39-30) and an 11 x 28 cassette installed on my
Silvio.
Now that I have venture out of the flat terrain of Norman and out onto the countryside, I found at my current weight and horsepower that I might need I little more "granny" gear for the steeper inclines.

LBS suggested that I might be able to use different cassette.

Any suggestions ?

 

[Doug Burton]

If you are willing to change derailleurs...

... you can use just about any Shimano 10-speed MTB cassette.

You'll need a Shimano 9-speed MTB derailleur, to take up the additional chain slack.

We have used the Deore M591 9-speed derailleur on up to 11/36 cassettes. It has a wide enough lateral travel to accomodate the 10 speed cassette, and its geometry and cable pull are the same as your Ultegra rear derailleur. 11/32 or 11/34 is probably what you'd want to use.

I am very slowly building a 53/39/30 Silvio with an 11/36 cassette and 105 brifters to look at how this system gets tuned, and how reliable it is. But Maria has tested the M591 setup as installed by their LBS on one of her Vendettas and it worked well.

Cheers,

Doug

 

[kenhardwick]

Switching to Deore M591 9-speed derailleur with 11/34 cassettes

thanks Doug...
Switching to Deore M591 9-speed derailleur with 11/34 cassettes..
Doesn't appear to be a very expensive switch..maybe $200 to have LBS do.
Thinking I might do that now and switch back to current setup if I loose enough weight.

Would that require any other change of equipment ? Brifters, chain..etc...

 

[mickjordan]

Re Shimano Cassette

You might be able to use an 11-32 cassette from an other vendor with your existing Ultegra setup. May have to mess with the B screw a bit to make sure there us adequate clearance between the pulley and the cassette in the biggest ring. Or you might be able to put a 28 or 26 granny on the FD, assuming the Silvio BB is ok with it, which is what I did on a Trek once. That is a very cheap solution.

I don't think you can mix Shimano shifters with another brand of derailleur as the index shifting is different. Cassettes are often interchangeble between vendors but that's about all.

 

[Charles.Plager]

You'll need the chain long

You'll need the chain long enough to safely shift to big-big (52-34), so you'll probably need a new chain.

What I don't know is how big is the granny gear on your triple. If it is a 72 BCD, it looks like it can handle down to a 24T granny gear. If it is 92 BCD, then 30T is as small as you can go. In my opinion, it's worth asking at your LBS. (I think the Ultegra has a 92 BCD unfortunately). As far as I know, there is nothing on the Silvio itself that would prevent you from having a tiny granny (where as I think 30T is as small as the Vendetta allows more or less).

Personally, I like having a reasonable middle and big chain ring and then having a really tiny granny gear. That way, I'm really using a compact double that has an emergency bail-out gear. The other advantage of having this setup is that you can keep a tight ( i.e., small spaces between the cogs on your cassette).

Cheers,
Charles

 

[randyspann]

26t granny

I'm with Charles: close step cassette like 12-27 and a 26t granny for bailing out. And about that 52/11 gear, you don't really use it do you?

 

[BobD]

Triple gearing.....a GREAT and timely post!

I plan to purchase my Silvio this week, and these are EXACTLY the issues I am thinking about in the middle of the night!!!

Doug has been great in sharing similar information to me as I figure out the component setup.

The Ultegra crank will be limited to a 30t ring as the smallest, given Shimano changed their BCD in recent years.

One can still put smaller rings on the 105 crankset....and perhaps other Shimano crankseta but I am not sure of that. Of course, one is not limited to Shimano cranks.

I have a 105 9spd with 52/39/24 that I had used on my LWB that I just sold. I may use that on the Silvio and set up the bike as 9 spd.....however will switch to a 30t ring. As Doug noted, I can always change it back to a 24 or 26(with a 105 set). With a 11-34 or 11-36 cassette I don't believe I will need a 24 or 26 ring. I also agree with Doug, if I don't really need a 24 or 26 with a larger cassette....why introduce additional chain slack and increase the risk of throwing the chain?

So, for instance Ken would have to use a different crankset to go with anything smaller than a 30 ring.

I am thinking about a couple of options before purchasing the Silvio. I am planning to go with an 11-34 or 11-36 9 spd Mtn cassette and use an XT RD that I have sitting on a shelf. Per Doug....the XT will work like the Deore 591.

However, as I am building up an old P-38 and may need these components I may end up going with a new 10 spd groupset. Either way, I will be using either a 11-34 or 11-36 MTN cassette and MTN RD.

Great move Ken....look forward to hearing how your Silvio responds on hills with the new cassette!!!

 

[kenhardwick]

Thanks for all the feedback...

Wow...you guy know your stuff....appreciate all the feedback...

Randy...don't use my 52 period...in fact, some of the teeth are bent/scrached from my crash with front tire blowout. So, need to replace that outside ring. Using the 39 - 11, I can use up to about 23-25 mph...any faster, like going downhill...I just coast.. But, do plan to get the 52 ring replaced.

Most likely I will check back with LBS to maybe purchase/install a 11-32 or 11-34 cassett and change derailler if needed.

 

[BobD]

Shimano Dynasys

Ken....and all....
I am plan to put a chain guard (light aluminum one) on my Silvio....also on the V2/K. Would be not only protective of the drivetrain....but more importantly for me of others nearby. I did see this posted here....but don't recall where/when.

Doug....or others???
Is the following an issue/concern for this issue of component interaction?

I am now thinking of using a new 10 spd 105 groupset with my Silvio. I like this idea for a number of reasons.....mostly because I can have the option of going with a smaller ring in the event I ultimately do need one (though I think I won't....will see). I plan to purchase a 10 spd Shimano 11-36 cassette to replace the road cassette. And....will use my 9 spd XT RD similar to Doug's suggestion. However, is this Dyna-Sys system so new that it will not work in congruence with a 9 spd RD? Would I need to purchase a 10 spd MTN RD?

???????
Bob PLEASE SEE BELOW



Shimano SLX CS-HG81-10 10 Speed Cassette 11-36

The addition of a massive 36 tooth cog is one of the key features of Shimano's new 10 speed Dyna-Sys range of drive trains.

The big advantage to the 36 tooth cassette is that you'll be able to stay in your middle and big rings longer meaning that you'll ultimately be shifting less. Who would have ever thought more gears would equal less shifting?

In-house measured weight including lock ring is 365g.

Cog sizes: 11, 13, 15, 17, 19, 21, 24, 28, 32, 36

One important thing to note: This cassette can only be used in conjunction with Shimano Dyna-Sys series components. Dyna-Sys was designed from the ground up to be used as one complete unit and parts from previous generations can not be mixed and matched.

 

[Doug Burton]

Shimano Dyna-Sys

...is going the way of SRAM components - they're playing with the cable pull ratios, and starting to use different ratios for road and MTB applications.

Makes me yearn for (and hoard) quality 8-speed and 9-speed parts.

The cassette spacing appears to be the same, so I suspect Dyna-Sys cassettes would work with other, non-Dyna-Sys derailleurs and chains. The caveat is that the Dyna-Sys cog thicknesses may be different, as apparently the chain thickness for a 10-speed MTB chain is differnt than for a 10-speed road chain.

This person has done some investigating:

http://forums.mtbr.com/drivetrain-shifters-derailleurs-cranks/dyna-sys-10-speed-compatability-9-speed-shimano-systems-646014.html

 

[Doug Burton]

To avoid all the above compatibility foolishnss...

... I selected a SRAM PG1030 11-36 cassette, which I bought from Amazon.

http://www.amazon.com/SRAM-PG1030-11-36-Speed-Cassette/dp/B00553Z00W/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1353796585&sr=8-1&keywords=SRAM+PG1030+cassette

Not expensive, and not cutting edge technology, but solidly made using cog widths and tooth patterns that work with SRAM chains, which I prefer over Shimano chains because of Shimano's stupid proprietary master chain pin approach.

SRAM has un-improved their removeable chain power link to be for single use (now called power lock, I believe) but it's the same technology with tighter clearances - I guess they're worried the link will fail if re-used. I plan on reusing them anyway - call me cheap.

 

[BobD]

Thanks to all.....especially Doug....

I have been enjoying my internal debate as to how to set up my new Silvio. I have decided to use the collection of 9 spd components I have gathered in my garage and put off re-habbing the 2002 P-38 that was going to use up these components. I will only need to pick up a few extra components and of course wheels.

I have a Shimano 105 52/39/24 crankset and will switch the 24 to 30 and see how that matches up with an 11-34 cassette. I can always put the 24 back on if needed.

It seems like all should be set up for some longer Winter rides the last week of December when I am off of work....cannot wait!

 

[defjack]

   Bob you might want to

Bob you might want to leave the 24 on and you should be plenty low.I have 52-39-30 and an 11-32 and could use a little lower but thats me.I dont do many hills here so I get worn out fast. I even run sram rocket gripshift and it works just fine. Jack

 

[Charles.Plager]

Hi Bob,
I agree with Jack.

Hi Bob,

I agree with Jack. If it's already there, leave it as 52/39/24. If you eventually decide it's too low, then bump it up.

Cheers,
"How Low Can You Go" Charles