Hit a nerve with this guy on youtube comments

[RojoRacing]

Most anyone can eventually ride a CB. Almost no one can ride them well. The problem is you have to balance power from both legs for the entire 360's on both legs at all times. When you don't, you have to counter the pressure of your powerful leg, with the less powerful upper body. In real life, this bike is like wrestling a very powerful reptile.... snake alligator your choose. After 2,000 mile and 1 year, I decided to try a non front wheel drive recumbent. It was a revelation and epiphany to how much fun a bent can be when you are not constantly fighting your legs. CB says you can make more power by incorporating your upper body. The TRUTH is you have to incorporate your upper body and that becomes very tiring... even after your in great shape. That is just the way it is. It is a flawed design... IMHO. UNLESS you are able to spin equally with both legs, your legs will always over power your arms and upper body. I have ridden with and behind many CB riders. Everyone of them fight the bike the entire time. I sold my CB at a loss, as fast as i could... and love my Bacchetta. The only way I would take a CB is if you gave it to me. Then I would sell it cheap! Yes I could rides hands off, supposedly the test to see if you are good enough. I guess the CB might be for some people, but the bike I found was dangerous. IF you are not paying attention, you can steer yourself real fast into a heap of trouble!!! Personally, i can not see how they are still in business.
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rojoracing531 day ago
That was my opinion for the first weeks and 500 miles I had mine and again through my first 24hour time trial at the world championships where I rode another 500 miles in just a day. If I had returned the bike to them after that trial period I would probably be writing a very similar comment to yours but I did return the bike and I worked at mastering it. The problem was I was so time crunched to get up to speed in my trial period before the race I had no time to refine the basics so I continually fought the bike. Now I'm so damn comfortable on it it's my bike of choice unless I want to ride in a group and need people to keep up with me to have fun. I've had DF riders draft off me for 10-20 miles at a time and after they realize I'm so much smoother then what they had imagined a bent to be they are comfortable only inches off my rear tire and we can hold a nice conversation while they draft me. I can't ride no handed but I have to admit I've never taken the time to practice, I know a few people who can do it so effortlessly that it's sickening.
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David Falgout11 hours ago
@rojoracing53 I understand your point of view. And..what is more important that we ride! That said, I have a question. Have you spent any time on a top shelf Bacchetta CA2.0 or Carbent? THAT IS set up correctly?
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rojoracing535 hours ago
@David Falgout Nope only in and around an aid station one time after I finished a double century and then drove out like 5 hours later to the last aid station wondering where my other friend was who just happened to be on a CA2.0. Of course, I was super wobbly on it as I would have expected nothing less from a quick spin. I was only chiming in because you seemed to have had such a poor experience that you blame the bike. I just wanted to share that I too swore the design was shit until I figured it out then it was great. As I told the Parkers before they sent me the bike, "I can ride anything on two wheels". I'm sure I could have just as much fun on a whole array or other types of bikes and bents as well. I only wish there were more bent riders willing to race down the mountains with me regardless of the type.
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David Falgout10 minutes ago
@rojoracing53 Yes more riders of bents would be great! Its not a "shit" design. To be more accurate it is a novel deign. Not in the main-stay for sure. Yes there are a few that can ride them and think they are great. I like you can ride anything with 2 wheels. I also raced motorcycles of all kinds. I also flew high performance aerobatic home built aircraft. I was quite good at it as well. One could say that I, ...like you... relate to machines. I rode the Silvio for a year. At the same time I had a Bacchetta Corsa. I did not like the aluminum frame corsa because the ride was very harsh. It was fast, but uncomfortable. The silvio CB was about as fast. Me, with my engineering background decided to really look at all of the ins and outs of both types. SO I will say now ( again what I found). A Moving bottom Bracket FWD Cruisebike requires more wattage and calories to cover miles vs a NON MBBFWD ( CA2.0). THE CB by its very design will involve the upper body and legs. The harder you push the more upper body is needed. If you spin vs push/ mash the pedals not as much upper body is needed. I experienced this and I have followed very accomplished CB riders that this was very evident. I prefer all my puny, weak human energy directed to pedals.... and pedals only. If some one else does not want this ( you) God bess and good luck. SO...in conclusion... you did not ride the Bacchetta much. I would appreciate it that in the future before you make statements that you qualify them. If you would have said I have many miles on both platforms like me, you point of view IMHO would be worth more. At this point you have a preference, however narrow minded and misinformed it may or may not be. In addition I used to follow all the top Bent riding racers. They could buy and ride any bike. FEW VERY FEW chose CB. The reason is the learned what I did..... by the school of hard knocks. Money and time lost. They were much more successful on anything but a CB. PEACE OUT!

 

[benphyr]

@RojoRacing
I saw the same youtube video with comments. Thank you for replying as a Cruzbiker and diamond frame biker with huge amounts of experience on both.

I was confused by this post at first until I realized you were quoting someone else. Could you add the heading identifying the author of the first comment:


David Falgout4 weeks ago

The 2nd sentence of your first comment above reads "but I did return the bike and I worked at mastering it" did you want to say "but I did keep the bike" instead of "return the bike"...?

Wow, that commenter could use a little more Peace in his Peace Out!

 

[castlerobber]

His profile name here and on BROL is "Wannabe". I met him at a local recumbent rally in 2015, and saw him ride that Silvio. Bryan Ball banned him from the BROL forums that fall for his anti-Cruzbike screeds.

"After 2,000 mile and 1 year"? David changes his claimed number of miles ridden on the Silvio to suit his purposes. From a comment I made on one of the BROL discussions:

In different places on this thread, you've variously represented yourself as having "about 600" miles, "~ 700" miles, and "100's" of miles on the Silvio. But when you put that bike up for sale on the CB forums in May, you claimed it had less than 300 miles on it. So I don't know what the right number is, but your skill level looked closer to 300 miles than 700.

 

[RojoRacing]

You can always tell you're talking to someone poisonous when all you say is you like something and they take that statement as meaning you hate everything else. I only wish there was another bent rider out here at the front of these mountain races regardless of the brand so I'd at least have someone to ride with. Of course, my results do nothing to prove the V20 is a good bike unless I try others and completely fail on those because that's how comparing works

 

[bladderhead]

He says that almost no one can ride them well. I wonder what he means by that? I know I am not a rocket on my Silvio, but I feel very confident and stable on it. Downhill at 45mph, I am worrying about tyre adhesion and bad road surface, but not wobbling at all. Commuting and shopping? I ride it in some nasty traffic, wind in out of the pedestrian barriers and the pedestrians, all with total confidence. Am I one of the almost no one? I do not remember anyone on this forum moaning and saying they are going back to their Metaphrastic. Are we all shilling for Cruzbike?

I fought the legs and the legs won.

 

[DavidCH]

Dont worry. If it hasnt got a world record then its not so fast. My vendetta always makes me smile and i always give it the respect it deserves.

 

[RojoRacing]

He says that almost no one can ride them well. I wonder what he means by that? I know I am not a rocket on my Silvio, but I feel very confident and stable on it. Downhill at 45mph, I am worrying about tyre adhesion and bad road surface, but not wobbling at all. Commuting and shopping? I ride it in some nasty traffic, wind in out of the pedestrian barriers and the pedestrians, all with total confidence. Am I one of the almost no one? I do not remember anyone on this forum moaning and saying they are going back to their Metaphrastic. Are we all shilling for Cruzbike?

I fought the legs and the legs won.

The irony is if you had asked me to write an opinion about the V20 after my first 1000 miles it would have sounded just like his, it's a broken design. Now you look at me and my recent videos and wonder is there anything faster with a good rider on it?

 

[ed72]

Wannabe is probably jealous. Envy creates bad.

Sometimes I get jealous of you V20 riders but the simple fact is my left hand, arm, and shoulder are so weak that I probably couldn't do it. Sometimes I do feel jealous to be honest but only on certain road conditions.

Two years ago, I applied my engineering background and understanding of bikes to the selection of a recumbent to take on Paris Brest Paris in August of 2019. Only the V20 and M5 met my criteria. I reckon it is horses for courses and in the end, 1230 Km is less about the arrow and more about the Indian to use a phase from the golfing world. It took me a really, really long time to learn how to ride it half decent and only after 2 very hard years of training do I make very, very close to the same power as on an upright. But only 700 or 1000 miles on the V20....that is nothing to adapt. Nothing. A good training week.

If the V20 is such a lousy broken design, why does it win everything?

I could state why the bacchetta recumbent did not meet my needs but why rain on Wannabe's parade.

 

[RojoRacing]

Half is me wants another one of these top double racers to get on a V20 and prove it’s a great bike and they can match my performance. The other more conceited half of me wants someone like Derek or Marco to try and fail, proving just how special my hard work and skill mean when mastering a different type of machine.

This only applies to these mountain races, on a typical 24hr event no question those top riders would match or eclipse my performance.

 

[bladderhead]

That would be a great advert for Cruzbike. Half of Jason Perez wins the race. Big reduction in weight. The two halves could make a relay team.

 

[paco1961]

I rode a Bachetta Ca2 for a while before I pulled the trigger on the CB purchase. Found it a piece of cake to ride even though it was a first bent experience (actually tried out a Backetta Giro 20 first but found that like pedaling a wheelbarrow full of concrete) Expected a learning curve on the CB and have to admit that at 6 months I was wondering if I had made the right decision. Was getting there but expected at that point to be as comfortable as I was on DFs. But now, at 14 months into this experiment I’d never go back. I rarely think about what I’m riding. I’m way more comfortable. And on top of it all I’ve gone from mid second group on fast club rides to mid first group.

One aspect of the mbbfwd design that I think gets overlooked is the lower pedal height. On the CA2 I always felt like I had to expend way more energy to keep my feet way up in the air.

To each his/her own.

 

[3bs]

Lucky for me I don’t have to choose just one.
And I am also lucky to have several serious upright riders that are dear friends.

They never criticize my bents. They never hesitate to ride close. In fact, the most common statement is “dude if you ever decided to really get back in shape you would be nutty fast.”

I am lucky

 

[castlerobber]

I...um, "engaged" him on that overly-high mileage claim. He went off on a couple more rants. It finally became clear that he thought I was @ratz, so I set that straight.

 

[ed72]

I dug up some reviews on BROL from an Aerolus member who owns the CA2, M5, and V20. He says the CA2 is 2 mph slower than both.

Who wants to ride a slow bike?

Especially one where your feet can't easily touch the ground at a redlight like on the V20 or M5.

Jus sayin.

 

[ratz]

I...um, "engaged" him on that overly-high mileage claim. He went off on a couple more rants. It finally became clear that he thought I was @ratz, so I set that straight.

Dam it Betsy now I had to create a youtube account just to comment after seeing that back and forth. What will I do now with an account I'll never use again.

 

[castlerobber]

I had to create a youtube account just to comment after seeing that back and forth. What will I do now with an account I'll never use again.

Sorry about that, Mr. packrats.

Those Mississippi "hills" he was complaining about were on the multi-use paths. No more than 1/2 mile long, most of them less; a few might get into the 5% range. We were on the beginner ride with a score of trikes and a couple of other two-wheelers.

 

[trplay]

This sounds like a post from several years back from a group of Cruzbike haters who were on there. They effectively ran off a lot of us and to an extent, a lot of the other ultra or racing type two-wheel fans.

 

[hurri47]

This sounds like a post from several years back from a group of Cruzbike haters who were on there. They effectively ran off a lot of us and to an extent, a lot of the other ultra or racing type two-wheel fans.

They didn't run me off. I just learned to use the "ignore" setting in their profiles. That was a pretty rough time though.

Actually I should thank those guys. They were so obviously full of crap that I decided to see for myself and bought my first Cruzbike.

-Dan

 

[trplay]

LOL, yes "run off" may have been a little strong. Basically, I simply realized the BROL community tent wasn't very interested in the performance side of recumbenteering.

 

[ratz]

The part I don't get is; do people really think the rest of us don't remember the lies and games of the past? Please everyone that's still raising kids or influencing grandkids warn them off hyperbole and the dangers of having to later save face when you look stupid and over extend.