How good are patches?
- Thread starter Osiris
- Start date
velocio
Austrian roadside steckerlfisch (fish on a stick)
Hey Osiris,
Are you asking about tubeless tire plugs, rather than patches for tubes? This kind of thing? http://www.dynaplug.com/carbonbike.html
-Jack
Are you asking about tubeless tire plugs, rather than patches for tubes? This kind of thing? http://www.dynaplug.com/carbonbike.html
-Jack
Osiris
Zen MBB Master
No, I'm talking about conventional tires with inner tubes. I see people by the side of the road fixing a flat on almost every ride I go on, and it made me wonder if a better solution (at least temporarily) would be to use a patch. I've never used on though, so I don't know how reliable they are.
Very reliable if done properly. It just takes 2-5 minutes for the glue to properly vulcanize and then time for the patch to set up nicely. I just bring two spare tubes, a spare tire, a normal Remo patch kit, and the stick on Park patches. The Park patches are immediate and work good but not the best for long term use. Tire? Yes, I actually had a massive sidewall blowout the other day when hammering at 30 mph, I never saw the rock that took the tire out. I have a boot but it was so badly destroyed that I just replaced it. But, I normally never patch tubes on the road. Not worth the time.
velocio
Austrian roadside steckerlfisch (fish on a stick)
In my experience traditional vulcanizing patches for inner tubes are as reliable and durable as the tube itself, if applied correctly. There is a little bit of technique to applying them, but not much. So called "glueless" patches are a popular option today, but I have no experience with those (actually, vulcanizing patches *are* glueless, so the nomenclature is a bit arbitrary). Here's a video that shows how to apply both types of patches:
In most cases you'll want to remove the inner tube to make it more convenient to patch, so why not just toss in a new tube and patch the holey one at home at your leisure?
-Jack
In most cases you'll want to remove the inner tube to make it more convenient to patch, so why not just toss in a new tube and patch the holey one at home at your leisure?
-Jack
If I am in a very remote area and far from home and if the weather is good when I flat, I'll eat something, replace the tube, and patch the replacement because one never knows when the next flat could come and they tend to be when it is sleeting, raining, or at anotherwise inopportune time
Osiris
Zen MBB Master
Personally, I don't trust patches enough to rely on them as a permanent fix. If I were to use one, it would only be to get me back home where I could replace the old tube with a new one.
What got me thinking about patches is that yesterday a rider in my group had to repair a flat which couldn't be fixed because he had forgotten to bring a spare tube with a valve long enough to fit his new deep section aero wheels, and no one else in our group had one to give him. It made me wonder how differently things could have gone if he could have patched the puncture instead. Then he wouldn't have needed a spare tube, and it might even have saved him the trouble of removing the rear wheel altogether.
Osiris
Zen MBB Master
My main concern is having a flat while riding my M1. The front and rear tires are different sizes, so I'd have to bring along a different inner tube for each tire. I was surprised when looking through all the stuff that Phil had included with the M1 and found a couple of inner tubes which he'd patched at least once. Evidently he had enough confidence in these patches to be riding around the track at 40 mph!
I trust patches more than the seams and valve cores. I have had plenty of both fail but never once in my life has a patch failed when done properly and if done properly, it is a slow leak. I also carry a spare valve core and extender.
Funny story. I came upon a Roadie a few weeks ago walking. I stopped. His tire was destroyed. I tried go give him my spare (it was a used 25mm GP4000). He would not take it. His car was 6 miles away. He walked in cleats all the way back. I begged him to take my tire. Nope. Humans are funny.
Funny story. I came upon a Roadie a few weeks ago walking. I stopped. His tire was destroyed. I tried go give him my spare (it was a used 25mm GP4000). He would not take it. His car was 6 miles away. He walked in cleats all the way back. I begged him to take my tire. Nope. Humans are funny.
To be more specific on the seams, I have had 3 or 4 Schwalbe extra light tubes that failed at the seam almost immediately. Their valves also are prone to fail, too. Otherwise very nice tubes. 
I have gone from Challenge latex to Vittoria latex for the most part. The Vittoria hold air a lot longer. I do not know why it is so, but it is. Punctures of latex tubes tend to lose air more slowly than butyl tubes giving me a chance to slow a bit. This has been a bad year, I have had four flats in around 4,000 miles. I only had one flat all last year. Three of them were due to hitting massive potholes in the dark during brevets, I saw them at the last minute but could do nothing but brace myself. On an upright, I would have bunny hopped them.
I have gone from Challenge latex to Vittoria latex for the most part. The Vittoria hold air a lot longer. I do not know why it is so, but it is. Punctures of latex tubes tend to lose air more slowly than butyl tubes giving me a chance to slow a bit. This has been a bad year, I have had four flats in around 4,000 miles. I only had one flat all last year. Three of them were due to hitting massive potholes in the dark during brevets, I saw them at the last minute but could do nothing but brace myself. On an upright, I would have bunny hopped them.
tiltmaniac
Zen MBB Master
I've ridden thousands of miles on patched tubes with nary an issue.
When done properly, they're as reliable (more, actually) as any other (original) seam in the tube-- they vulcanize the rubber making it one big piece of rubber, patch and tube together!
The only real downside is that it is a few grams more weight than without the patch
When done properly, they're as reliable (more, actually) as any other (original) seam in the tube-- they vulcanize the rubber making it one big piece of rubber, patch and tube together!
The only real downside is that it is a few grams more weight than without the patch
Osiris
Zen MBB Master
Well, I guess I'm sold on patches then. The question now is, which are the most reliable patches to buy? Any recommendations?
And what do you all recommend for re-inflating the tube after I've patched it? Does it make sense to carry a portable air pump, or should I stick with the CO2 cartridges?
And what do you all recommend for re-inflating the tube after I've patched it? Does it make sense to carry a portable air pump, or should I stick with the CO2 cartridges?
Mathew Fy
GRU
I use the vulcanizing patch kits. In my younger years I’d have as many as 6 or seven patches before replacing a tube. It should be noted that once the glue is opened it starts to dry out, so it’s a good idea to replace it.
I carry a couple CO2 cartridges and a pump (in case of multiple flats or pumping up a slow leak to limp home).
Osiris
Zen MBB Master
I'm going to see about picking up a few vulcanizing patch kits later today.
Am I right in assuming that when using a patch kit, it's not necessary to remove the wheel from the bike? Removal and re-installation of the drive wheel is something I dread doing.
Mathew Fy
GRU
I once patched a friend’s bike that way at the roadside (bolt-on wheels, no wrench). You need to locate the hole in the tube, patch it, and make sure there’s nothing still poking through the tire. A small piece of glass can be hidden in the rubber but cut through while riding.
The wheel removal & replacement gets easier with practice. There’s some discussion in the forum somewhere.
All this talk makes me want to get back to tubeless. I had to tube-in after a sidewall cut failed to seal last fall.
RAR
Well-Known Member
I spread my fork a little so it's a tight fit to the chain stays; when I pull the wheel the chain stay is tight against the fork and stays in place, so does the derailleur.
Osiris
Zen MBB Master
I have a set of tubeless wheels/tires on my V20. It's the recumbent I spend 90% of my time riding and the only one I take on public roads. The other two bents are for trails only, so I don't worry as much about flats there. Still, I'd rather avoid the unpleasantness of having to remove the drive wheel to fix a flat if I can avoid it.
I just bought four packages of the Park Tool patches featured in the video above, so now I'll have one for each bike/bent. Maybe I don't need to take along any bulky spare tubes now.
Patches are great, but I wouldn't expect the glue to work if it is raining and everything is soaking wet.
Anyone here had success patching a tube in the rain (or snow)?
