SRAM brifters, rear D, etc...

[trapdoor2]

Ok, attempting to gather goodies for the impending Vendetta here...need some help.

I would like to run the 11-36 cassette if I can...but SRAM site sez it is only compatible with the 1x medium-cage derailleur (or the long)...and the 1x shifters (presumably). I'm looking at the Rival 22 group.

Has anyone tried using the 1x medium or long cage rear D with brifters? The 11-32 cassette is compatible but if the brifters will shift the longer cages...why not?

I'm completely new/clueless on brifters, I've been running the X0 twist grips on my V2/k and thumb/bar-ends on everything else. Gonna be a whole new world out there...

 

[RojoRacing]

my v20 came with rival 20 speed brifters and a long cage x9 RD that worked fine with a 36t. I'm not clear on the 22 and 11 speed crossover compatibility though. I'm currently on Red 22 hydro with a 32t in the rear and it's the bomb.

 

[RojoRacing]

Sram doesn't make anything between a 32t and a 42t in the 11 speed range so you'll have to go shimano for your cassette which is fine but something to think about.

 

[RojoRacing]

Sram doesn't make anything between a 32t and a 42t in the 11 speed range so you'll have to go shimano for your cassette which is fine but something to think about.

never mind this was only true with the highest grade of components

 

[RojoRacing]

ok after some research you'll need rival 22 speed brifters then the rival 1 RD in ether mid or long cage meant for CX racing. you'll have several mid grade sram cassette options as well. You could probably save a little money as well as move up to force components if you went with 10 speed. i'm really not a fan of any brands third tier components when it come to brake and shifter feel.

 

[Robert O]

I'm running 11 speed SRAM TT-500 bar end shifters into an X-7 version 2 RD, with a PG-1170 11 speed cassette (11-36). The pull on all of the SRAM shifters and brifters should be the same.

 

[ratz]

I just went through all of this myself about 2 weeks ago building the BOM for my son's new gravel grinder; I came really close to ordering the wrong stuff until I doubled back and checked the manuals in depth and called my SRAM TechSupport contact.

In short don't use a 1x rear derailleur; it doesn't have the rotation to account for the double in the front, they specifically designed that out. It is tempting to use them because there is a ton cool stuff in the next 1x stuff.

Instead get the tried and trusted 2x mountain bike stuff.
All SRAM derailleurs use the same two pull motions and only the twist grip shifter can't be intermixed with the really new stuff but I digress.

Summary
The 10speed - 2x stuff is all the same road or mountain as is the 11sp road.
The 11speed mtb stuff has a different pull rate (see later post)

The 1x stuff has the same pull (as it's matching family) but is optimized for the single in front, it doesn't do the parallelogram shift the suntour invented and that all 2x and 3x compatible derailleur employ. Lacking that will cause excess chain and gear wear if you use it with a double in the front.

The derailleur that will work with a rival 22 brifter are:
SRAM GX 2x10 Medium or long cage
SRAM XX 2x10 Medium or long Cage
an

The GX and XX also have the lock out clutch which is a real plus on a CB. The XX stuff is on pair with the Force and Red stuff. The GX would be Rival grade so I would put the GX on a Rival 22 build.


The boys bike turned out to be NX. 1x with and XD drivers I plan to put some photos on line soon as these parts would make an interesting 1x11 Silvio. The 32x front front ring with the 10-42T is pretty wild looking. That Cassette is HUGE.


Corrected**to reference the 10speed rd stuff that will work on 11speed.

 

[MrSteve]

On the Vendetta, its SRAM Force brifters mate very well with the long-cage SRAM GX 2.1 rear der.
Shifting is smooth and crisp.
The 10-speed gear cluster is a Shimano 11-36 that was on sale: It is kind of heavy, but has a reputation for not breaking.
To finish the installation of the SRAM GX 2.1, which was on sale, I transplanted the barrel adjuster from
my SRAM rival rear derailleur to the new one: The adjuster sits nicely in its new home and works well, if you don't mind
using both hands.
As always, make sure that your cables and housings are working smoothly!

 

[trapdoor2]

Many thanks, gentlemen. Exactly the info I was looking for. GX 2x11 it will be. With the long cage, I should be able to even use the 10-42 cluster if I need it....

 

[Mathew Fy]

Marc,
You are thinking about mixing road brifters with a mountain derailleur. The mountain products use "X-ACTUATION", while the road products use "EXACT ACTUATION." I don't know if this slight difference in cable travel matters, but the Shiftmate 8 from jtekengineering is designed to compensate.

I can confirm excellent results using the following SRAM combination:
10-42 cassette,
GX 2x11 long cage rear derailleur (mountain),
Force 22 braze-on front derailleur with YAW (road),
GX 2 x 11 trigger shifters.
Origin8 Space Carbon UL8 off road handle bar,
Ergonomic GP5 grips.

I should post some photos and update my profile soon, I've had the V for nearly a month!

BTW, the Vendetta is designed for road-style front derailleur mounts.

 

[Don1]

òk... for laughs (and for my build later) whats fits with shimano parts... 34-50 chainset and 11-36 11speed cluster.... since sram parts get $$$ in australia..

 

[ratz]

òk... for laughs (and for my build later) whats fits with shimano parts... 34-50 chainset and 11-36 11speed cluster.... since sram parts get $$$ in australia..

Shimano is a mixed bag. All the 11sp road stuff maxes out at 32T for the GS style rear derailleurs. You best bet with Shimano and low gears; is some of the older 10 speed stuff with a MTB rear derailleur and a cable pull adapter from Jtekengineering.

Blah hate Shimano's web site. This is about a low in the MTB derailleurs that you probably would go.

http://bike.shimano.com/content/sac...ng---braking/rear-derailleur/rd-m8000-gs.html

then match with the correct shiftmate; probably going to be limited to a 10sp Shifter of some sort. Which the Shiftmate 6 can do.

http://www.jtekengineering.com/resources/shiftmate-compatibility/

 

[ratz]

Marc,
You are thinking about mixing road brifters with a mountain derailleur. The mountain products use "X-ACTUATION", while the road products use "EXACT ACTUATION." I don't know if this slight difference in cable travel matters, but the Shiftmate 8 from jtekengineering is designed to compensate.

Good post those are the terms I couldn't remember last night, too tired, I knew I was forgetting a key point.

The heart of the matter is cable pull.
Exact Actuation (Road 10 & 11sp, Mtn 10sp) is 3.1mm
X Actuation (Mtn 11sp) is 3.48mm

So there is NO cross compatibility. The Rival 22 won't work with the GX 2x11 RD without the JtekAdapter

BUT..... (there's always a butt).....

Rear derailleurs don't really have any travel distance smarts.

So you can Pair Rival 22 Brifters with a MTN 10S-p derailleur and put it on an 11-SP Cassette.

So what you want is Rival22+ GX-RD-2x10.
That will work find without the adapter.

I'll double back and fix my sleepy time error on the other post

 

[ratz]

I should post some photos and update my profile soon, I've had the V for nearly a month!

Oh that's almost a criminal failure around here. Oh Charles!!!!

 

[Robert Holler]

There are good pieces of advice above. I have built more Cruzbikes than I can count with everything under the sun and the GX is great. 10 speed is flawless, 11 speed - MEH in my opinion but I tent to remain old school until the next big thing is not the next big thing.

I steer clear of Shimano stuff at all costs. Thats just me.

 

[trapdoor2]

Roger dodger: 2x10.
Having been a hot-rodder my whole life, I have no troubles with mix 'n' match. I went out to the jtek site and it appears that the Shiftmate 9 would make the SRAM Road brifters work with the SRAM MT rear D.
Finding a Shiftmate 9 is a whole nuther kettle of fish. I've used them (shiftmates...completely forgot about them) on other bikes but I think I'll just go with the 2x10 rear D and be happy!

 

[RojoRacing]

Roger dodger: 2x10.
Having been a hot-rodder my whole life, I have no troubles with mix 'n' match. I went out to the jtek site and it appears that the Shiftmate 9 would make the SRAM Road brifters work with the SRAM MT rear D.
Finding a Shiftmate 9 is a whole nuther kettle of fish. I've used them (shiftmates...completely forgot about them) on other bikes but I think I'll just go with the 2x10 rear D and be happy!

those shift mates look a lot like the old rollamagig we used to use to reduce the massive housing loops on the RD in the past. They didn't have anything to do with ratios, they were just a round wheel in a 90 deg housing that let you make 90 deg turns without extra drag. I looked everywhere for one to use the the Vendetta but alas they stopped making them like 15 years ago.

 

[trapdoor2]

those shift mates look a lot like the old rollamagig we used to use to reduce the massive housing loops on the RD in the past. They didn't have anything to do with ratios, they were just a round wheel in a 90 deg housing that let you make 90 deg turns without extra drag. I looked everywhere for one to use the the Vendetta but alas they stopped making them like 15 years ago.

There's two rollamajigs on ebay at the moment, one grey plastic version and one of the earlier aluminum ones. I might snag an aluminum one, just to have on the bench in case I need it someday.

 

[RojoRacing]

Yup I saw those but I'm probably going to go a step further and design the perfect on for the vendetta. If you guys are lucky I'll make in a way I can easily make a dozen or so for everyone. So far I've found a nice nylon pulley wheel with a ball bearing pre-installed for $10. Now I just need to machine the housing out of a block of Delron. This is one of those perfect jobs for 3d printing.

 

[trapdoor2]

Cool. I used to be a line supervisor in a large machine shop. It was very nice to have all the tools to make goodies like that. Those days are long gone for me.
However, I have had some parts made by 3D printing recently. I was amazed at the cleanliness of the finished product. I only had to lightly ream the thru-holes...the rest was fine 'as printed'.
I would like to get in line for one of your headrest clamps...nice and simple design, well done.