Think I'm Going to Love This

[efwYVR]

So I'm only a handful of rides in, and already I think the Vendetta and I are going to get along just fine.

The learning curve was steep at first, and while there where some very close calls, no skin or paint was harmed. I swapped my Bacchetta Giro for the Vendetta, which I had for about 10 years, so I'm not new to recumbents. Still, an MBB is a very different animal, and I fully expected it would take some getting used to. Perhaps I managed my expectations well because as it turns out the learning curve has flattened out considerably. It will still be many more km before I'm really comfortable, but I'm confident enough now to go out on quiet city streets and bike paths.

So initial riding impressions?... I really love the sensation of being able to drive all your pedal stroke power to the front wheel. You can really grab the handle bars and get your whole body into the game. I never felt that with the Bacchetta -- it was all and only legs, which made hills not only a challenge, but a pain. So on my third ride out I was anxious to try some small hills. Wow, what a difference! Felt like I was attacking the hill, and the more I worked the faster I went. On my Bacchetta my aim was to simply maintain speed on hills. With the Vendetta, I felt I could actually accelerate -- and I still haven't taken the training wheels off. Can't wait to gain more experience.

The other thing I like about the Vendetta is that it forces you to be very focused on technique. You can't be sloppy on a Vendetta, and I think in the long run that will pay dividends in speed and riding enjoyment.

On the down-side?... I'm still in set-up phase so don't want to be premature, but I think the headrest is going to give me issues. I just can't seem to get in in a position that is comfortable while wearing a helmet. Fortunately, I'm used to not having one with the Bacchetta, so I'm making do, but the seat angle makes it more of a necessity on the Vendetta. I'll be looking at the headrest accessory threads for sure.

Here are a couple pics of my custom build. Mostly SRAM Force 22 with discs (love them), and one of the reasons I went with a frame build. Feel free to ask me any questions.

 

[jond]

Re the headrest. It is very very common to have the head rest too far in.

Seems counterintuitive to let it out for comfort but letting it out brings your head more vertical.

Lots find oem comfy I do with addition of innertube 23 mm inflated three rows wide

Others try factory options after market etc and info is here on forums. Search headrest etc.

Finding a helmet that does not interfere is covered too. A lot use giro air attack shield but that helmet is getting old.

Take your time and remember small adjustments can and do make a world of difference.

Enjoy your thoroughbred

 

[benphyr]

Welcome @efwYVR . Glad to see another Canadian Cruzbiker.

 

[DavidCH]

Giro air attack... i havent tried the new version... i think its called the vanquish. The giro works for me as the shield just about reaches my cheek bones so its super aero. The other day i had a good ride with my super airy helmet but ended up with sore eyes . I live in an arid dusty climate. If you are hitting 50kph you might want to use a full shield and glasses on underneath. Then you don't get sore eyes.... just a hot head.

 

[3bs]

welcome.
congrats on the raptors
good color choices.
i also run sram f22, but rim brakes.
i still have shifting issues as i play with cassettes and rings and things they say not to do.

when it comes to head rests, you can see i am currently trying the adjustable. it is more complicated with me because i run a wedge. (stomach valve does not accept stock seat angle.) i never had a head rest that i liked, and i am still not happy. i also have a thor seat that i just cant seem to get right on this bike, even though the seat profile is almost identical to my wedge set up.

"The other thing I like about the Vendetta is that it forces you to be very focused on technique. You can't be sloppy on a Vendetta"

this is actually one of the things i dislike about the V. keeping in mind i have less than 2000 miles on this bike, but i switch around a lot between bikes and trikes, and when i am out thrashing, i often ride till i can barely walk. so sloppy uncoordinated behavior is not uncommon. this bike does not suffer me well during those periods. and popping between other bikes that are not mbbfwd is sometimes comical.

but, that said, i learned to daydream while driving a 911 on a track, so i trust my day will come.

 

[Kenneth Jessett]

This is the modification I made for the headrest issue:

The yellow dog bone under the seat is my attempt to raise the seat angle - which actually works.

 

[3bs]

i did something similar as one of my experiments. not the dog bone, but the rest...do you find more dogs chasing you with that stuck there?


i think that i would really prefer something like a neck rest rather than a proper head rest, and really for most of my riding i just keep my head up because it is really hard to look thru my spectacles, and it helps my horizon orientation. i went thru this on my tica and my trikes with similarly mixed results.

maybe i am just not a headrest kinda guy.

 

[DavidCH]

You might prefer to be more aero and cut the headrest down like i did. LOL

I also took the inners out of my ventisit deluxe cushion and rapped it around and made a neck rest.

 

[Kenneth Jessett]

A friend of mine who has an M5 and a Bachetta refers to the Vendettas as coming off Beta production lines since they need so much after market fiddling to make them operable.

 

[jond]

A friend of mine who has an M5 and a Bachetta refers to the Vendettas as coming off Beta production lines since they need so much after market fiddling to make them operable.

Lol it’s not the vendetta off the Beta production line rather the riders.

Vendetta fits way more riders in the 700 c wheel speed market than any m5 or Bacchetta. Or schlitter. Stick bikes and short legs with 700c wheels is a real stop start difficulty and if you’re tall an m5 especially with that fixed tiller is problematic. And if you want to turn right with the chain dropped at slow speed forget it. The frontal view for the vendetta is best too as is the driveline noise and imho the efficiency of that driveline .

I’m considering though a Pelso brevet as a possible audax n+1 bike. But it’s light weighted front wheel is putting me off despite its professional beautiful appearance .
And it’s front mech arrangements are perplexing especially if you like cables.

Got to say the vendetta is the smartest design off shelf fast bike suited to all. Tall or short big guts no guts . It caters for all. Less fettling required than most and much much greater adjustment and range of options both oem and yeah aftermarket and personal mods. Which other company so graciously adopts the ideas of merit from its customer base and actually truly cares .

The fact a lot of people customise unique to themselves is testament to the design and the skill of the tribe.

Also many people audax on the vendetta regularly so it really is a pretty versatile tt bike.

Nah the vendetta really is a mature smart developed thoughtful catering frameset. Nothin beta about her.

The frame development tells the story. My v20 is a far better frameset than my V2 now retired ever was.

 

[jond]

i did something similar as one of my experiments. not the dog bone, but the rest...do you find more dogs chasing you with that stuck there?


i think that i would really prefer something like a neck rest rather than a proper head rest, and really for most of my riding i just keep my head up because it is really hard to look thru my spectacles, and it helps my horizon orientation. i went thru this on my tica and my trikes with similarly mixed results.

maybe i am just not a headrest kinda guy.

The problem with any headrest is the fitting to suit all head shapes and comfort equation. My vendetta headrest standard with innertube cushion is way way better than my catrike 700 standard or closed cell foam insert in terms of rattle transference. I’m talking bad roads pothole repaired acne. 28 mm tyres at 70psi stuff.

If you have not tried the inner tube trick do so before you spend money on other options.

Another very important point noted repeatedly is that many new riders me included thousands of klm in have their headrest in too far. It seems counter intuitive to let it out but doing so brings your head more vertical so you don’t look at the sky so much.

 

[LarryOz]

So I'm only a handful of rides in, and already I think the Vendetta and I are going to get along just fine.

Great write up of your first impressions.
I have a V20 and love it. My first Cruzbike was a Silvio S30 almost exactly 5 years ago. I had never ridden a recumbent before that and the learning curve was huge for me. I traded the Silvio for a Vendetta after about 4 months because I was addicted to the speed. For me it is all about the speed.
About the headrest. I love the stock headrest. I am short 5'7" and it just fits me perfectly, but I actually had to cut the top of the seat off to be able to push it down into the frame far enough to fit me correctly.
Depending if you want to be as aero as possible for speed or more upright for more visibility is probably going to dictate which way you go with any headrest or seat mods. Many people have installed a Thor seat a love it, but it does curve up more at the back so it is less aero because it sticks your head up higher in the air flow.
My advice for the headrest is to get someone to shoot some video of you (or pics) and move it around little bits at a time until it feels and looks good. For more aero benefit, I have the headrest hit my head just below the back of my Giro Attack helmet. I also have the helmet it rotated towards the front as much as possible. The helmet should face directly into the wind for best aero. A little extra rubber padding the headrest may also help.
If you are still having fitting issues, post some pics and we can help
After 5 years I've got over 70K miles on my Vendetta and just love it and the MBB format. Have fun learning to ride it - but watch out, you'll just want to ride it more and more and more once you get it dialed in.
Larry

 

[benphyr]

... After 5 years I've got over 70K miles on my Vendetta ...

That's an average of 14,000 miles/year (22,400 km/year)! I guess spending on high end components isn't that much when you spread it over that many km. I think when my wife was on maternity leave we drove less km that year with our car! @LarryOz, your understated comment on how much you love your V completely hi-jacked my thoughts away from this thread - very relevant though they are.

to regular programming: Go get 'em @efwYVR.

 

[benphyr]

After 5 years I've got over 70K miles on my Vendetta

That's a pretty serious Vendetta you've got @LarryOz.

It brings to mind my favourite movie: “I have been in the revenge business so long, now that it is over I do not know what to do with the rest of my life.” - Inigo Montoya from William Goldman's "The Princess Bride."

 

[efwYVR]

So some good news... I may have solved my headrest issue. As others have said, it could just be the helmet. As it turned out, one of my 4 helmets did the trick... An older Bell I was only using for mountain biking, but as it turns out it's a nice snug fit on The Vendetta, and keeps my head at a perfect angle. I was already using the Bacchetta at almost full recline so I'm quite used to the view from there. Now onto hydration and cargo... getting kinda critical now because my rides are lasting 2+ hrs and I'm getting thirsty.

 

[benphyr]

@efwYVR Pretty soon YVR is going to be repurposed by the rest of us to Your V20 Ride.

 

[efwYVR]

Very clever @benphyr

 

[LarryOz]

So some good news... I may have solved my headrest issue. As others have said, it could just be the helmet. As it turned out, one of my 4 helmets did the trick... An older Bell I was only using for mountain biking, but as it turns out it's a nice snug fit on The Vendetta, and keeps my head at a perfect angle. I was already using the Bacchetta at almost full recline so I'm quite used to the view from there. Now onto hydration and cargo... getting kinda critical now because my rides are lasting 2+ hrs and I'm getting thirsty.

For Hydration I use the race case in the back and mount a bottle holder under the boom in the front (see pic) This give me 3 water bottles of any size - I use 20 oz (or 2 bottle and a large bladder - 2 or 3 liters I think) - This is usually enough to get me through most century races unless I am "really" ride a maximum effort (or extreme heat), then I might need any bottle or 2.

This picture was from my 3 hour ride on yesterday morning. It was still a little dark as I was finishing my setup. riding early and cooler I tend to drive much less. Even after 3+ hours out, I had only used 1/2 of my bottles. maybe I am part camel??

 

[chicorider]

About the headrest question: I made four modifications that made all the difference for me. I am 5'5".

1. I agree that a common mistake might be setting the headrest too far forward. It's not meant to be a neckrest--the neck being a pretty delicate structure that probably should not be subject to such contact and vibration. I want the pad to contact the bony knob at the base of my skull. To help this happen I used a bench vice to bend the headrest forward a bit so that I could keep it off of my neck while creating more contact area for the lower-back portion of my head.

2. I put a small one inch foam wedge at the top of the seat. I made this out of the high-impact foam found behind bumper caps on modern cars. It's firm, super light, and easy to shape (I use a belt sander). I got my piece for $2.00 from a pick-n-pull lot. The stuff is laying all over the place. Shape it how you like and paint it black. I finished my small wedge off with a folded shop rag. It gives a bit of flexibility to allow my shoulder blades to settle in with no hot spots, and when I have to stop to fix a flat or a derailed chain, I have a rag to wipe my hands (mostly) clean.

3. I use 1 inch high density furniture foam, folded over inside the black mesh sock to make a 2 inch cushion. I bought a roll of this on eBay and swap in a new piece about every six months when it feels "flat."

4. My helmet is a Lazer O2, which has the adjustment knob at the top rather than the back. I trimmed off a cross-piece at the back of the adjustable band to create an open space that eliminates contact between the helmet and headrest. The helmet is still adjustable and stays put. It also has a visor that works great to keep the sun out of my eyes and off my face.

As others have said, your mileage may vary. But these tweaks worked well for me without having to take more drastic measures. In the meantime, keep on riding. I'm four years in with my V and I love it. I wouldn't go back to a DF bike, even if my back would let me.

 

[3bs]

I am now playing with the adjustable headrest in a different fashion. I will post after I ride it more