Vendetta as a serious randonneuring bike.

fthills

Well-Known Member
Today is a rest day in the

http://www.audax.org.au/public/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=215%3Agt-qld-v2&catid=35%3Amajor-rides&Itemid=96

Its a 9 day event in which the intention is to complete a 400 then 200 then 300 and finally a 600 km brevet.

I haven't yet completed the unbox and build thread because preparations for this super series made time a bit short.

I hesitated taking the V for this event. It was newly built with no more than a few hours of test ride time but in a brief test on my local hill I knew the V can climb and that sealed the deal. The V was going to far north queensland, so ,dismantle everything into a box and a couple of bags and off we go.

The 400 started at 10 pm at night and for me finished about 26 hours later. Well within cut off time. The outstanding feature of this ride is that the last 60 km were dominated by some serious steep climbing. More experienced randonneurs than I observed that this was some of the most difficult climbing that they had done.. For example 8% was typical but afew were around the 10% mark and whilst its not too bad doing a few of these ,a 60km stretch of this stuff against the clock is a pretty good test of man and machine

The 200 just finished , was shorter but dominated at the end by a 16km, 8 % average grade.

I would never have completed these two rides in the allocated time on my normal rear wheel drive recumbent.

First I can push much higher gears on the V. In my build thread i mentioned that on my RWD bent i used a 22 tooth front chainring and a 34 tooth at the back. In part this confirms my weak climbing abilities but thats what it took to get me to the top of steep hills albeit slowly.

On the V the ultegra triple with a 30tooth small chainring and 34 cassette gets me up the hills. If my calculations are correct the V is able to develop 30%. more distance per revolution of the crank with what feels like the same amount of power from my legs.

I don't know how to explain this remarkable state of affairs in enginneering terms but there is something about the V that makes it a far more efficient bike than the three other I own.

It raised the hair at the back of my neck and a shiver of emotion in the bitterly cold hours of tuesday morning when I realised I was going to complete a very hard 400 on a recumbent. For me ,the early evidence , is that the V is going to open up big possibilities for my long distance riding.

The next few days with the 300 and 600 km brevets will tell me more about what the V can do.

But this I know, the V is a cracker of a bike. John Tolhurst you're a genius and I dips me lid to you.
 

fthills

Well-Known Member
300km finished last night at

300km finished last night at 10:30 pm. Time allowed for a 300 is 20 hrs. My previous fastest is 18.5. Yesteday on the V 17.5

But tomorrow the 600km brevet is the real test. Not so much of the V . Since it has shown me what it can do . We'll see if the engine can match the quality of the bike.
 

Jim Parker

Cruzbike, Inc. Director
Staff member
Easy storage on the Vendetta


Thanks for that great report. Good luck with the 600K.

By comparison, the ride Maria and I did yesterday, 116 miles with 6000 feet of climbing, seems pretty minor. Today we did 54 miles, mostly flat, but at a steady, fast pace, and through pouring rain.

Regarding the Vendetta as a serious randonneuring bike... Yes, it's fast, comforatble on the long rides, and climbs like a billy goat. But where do you carry your stuff?

We just got the new Bacchetta Brain Box. Compared to the old design, this one fits easily and quickly on the Vendetta, with no drilling or zip ties required. You can see it in these photos I took yesterday. It has an insulated sleeve for a water reservoir, and it worked great. You can see the drink tube coming out of the top.

We stopped to look at these giant-horned bulls. Maybe they'll inspire John next time he re-designs the handlebars.

Jim
bulls with horns.jpg


bulls with horns 2.jpg
 

fthills

Well-Known Member
Its done.
Not that I've done


Its done.

Not that I've done many but this was the hardest 600 so far. Finished three and a half hours before the cut off time and had 90 minutes of sleep last night . I'll gather my thoughts over the next few days for a report on the V's assets as a randonneurs bike and I hope to have some photos too.
 

delcrossv

New Member
Awesome! Just the news I

Awesome! Just the news I needed to hear! Let us have the report and photos when you're recovered fthills. Quite an accomplishment.
 

fthills

Well-Known Member
Thank you all .

Thank you all for the good wishes and compliments.

Jim ,I have a few photos to post soon showing the luggage arrangements, but , warning:
it doesn't look pretty.

In part it was all a bit of a rush to get it up to queensland , so the V is not in its final configuration. It has no handlebar tape for example and i used the seat stays as anchorage points for my bananas using electricians tape

Dellcroosv, thank you too. Its hard to know for sure why the V is significantly faster than my other bikes. As I mentioned earlier I don't think I'm exerting more power . In fact I'm much less fit than I was this time last year leading up to PBP.

The frame /seat is very stiff ,there is zero movement between them.

The front triangle which contains the drive train is stiiff.

Both much more rigid than on the RWD. The chain is shorter . The bike unloaded, is lighter by about 1.5kg compared to my RWD,

I'm more reclined but not by much. Is one of these factors the most important , or do they all contribute or is it something else altogether ?

I dont know .

One other feature I haven't mentioned is that the Ultegra triple front has a 50 tooth chainring as its largest chainring at the front. On flat ground and descents I spent a lot of time on it and the smallest ring at the back. On my other bikes I couldn't push a 50 toooth chainring, it would just be too much.

Also I prefer to spin less on the V compared to the RWD. Its hard to explain but so far I've found a cadence somewhere between spinning and outright mashing to be my preferred approach to pedalling.
 

fthills

Well-Known Member
Some Pics

Warning: bike designers might want to look away at this point , in its configuration at the end of the brevet series the V is far from its typical elegant , sleek lines . The pics were taken with a poor camera so my apologies.

IMG_0083.JPG


I added shoulder support to the top of the seat but no head rest, its made out of foam (see build thread). The light blue seat foam is very firm and regains its shape very quickly once stepping off the seat.

IMG_0086.JPG


The front triangle, components are SRAM XO ten speed derailleur, AYUP lights, small saddlebag on the front boom held with velcro strap, handlebar is 44cm salsa woodchipper

IMG_0087.JPG



Campagnolo Centaur brifters, Garmin 705 (too short a battery life for the longer brevets)

IMG_0088.JPG



Closer view of the lights and Ultegra triple , Crank bros pedals

IMG_0093.JPG


Exposure on the pic is all wrong but this is the saddlebag arrangement Two attached to the underside of the seat and one on seat stays

IMG_0094.JPG


Boom arrangement on non drive side, tyre pump is attached to water cage.

IMG_0095.JPG


A little nook in the chainstay for the Ayup battery , solidly held by velcro straps.
 

fthills

Well-Known Member
There are also saddlebags on

There are also saddlebags on the back of the shoulder support but photos don't show them well. saddlebags are the sort that are normally put under a conventional diamond frame bicycle saddle.
 

mickjordan

Well-Known Member
Re PICS

Seems from your comment that you did PBP last year as I did (on a DF). What did you ride?

Like the AYUP lights - good Aussie technology - I've turned quite a few US riders onto them. However, I got a SON20R for PBP and an Edelux, just using the AYUP as a helmet light. I plan to use the dynamo wheel (a Mavic Open Pro built by Peter White Cycles) on my Silvio next season. I just invested in an eWerk charger that will run off the same dynamo and will charge my Garmin, iPhone etc.
 

fthills

Well-Known Member
Hi Mick ,
Rode a metaphysic


Hi Mick ,

Rode a metaphysic with an MTB drivetrain .

Took 88 hrs but precious little sleep,and not much time spent at controls in spite of the excellent food offerings. Total sleep was around 5 hours or so in snatches here and there by the roadside. Looking at my brevet card on the return i was averaging just above 14 km/hr and its only a fast couple of stages at the start that built just enough buffer to complete the whole thing in time. Fantastic cycling event fast or slowly done.

I've not put an Ayup light on the helmet. Do you feel the weight of it on a long ride ? An easy way for me to find out is to try it for myself.

I have heard very good things about the eWerk , the only reason i hesitate running a dynamo is it saps a little bit of energy from the hub, is this true or overstated ?
 

mickjordan

Well-Known Member
PBP and eWerk

I did the 84 hr option hoping not to have to ride through the night. day 1 went to schedule despite the thunderstorms, but day 2 I struggled to make minimum speed and had to skip my hotel in Carhaix and ride through the night to Loudeac. I finished in 82 hours with 7 hours sleep. I wish they had a 90 hr morning start option. My knees have never quite recovered.

You do notice the AYUP on the helmet but it is not significant, compared with being able to see into bends, what gear you are in, street signs, etc.

I used the eWerk and my Edelux on a double century last weekend and could not detect any difference in light intensity. The LED lights are so power miserly. I also use a cache battery, and Energizer XP2000, which charges at 0.5a and 5v, and then recharge the devices from that, as many devices do not like variable power input. The eWerk cache battery is ridiculously expensive (as the eWerk is really). The XP2000 works just fine.
 

fthills

Well-Known Member
I don't know if this will be

I don't know if this will be true the longer I ride the V. but I had less pain during these series of brevets around my knees, than on other rides. I wonder if its the MBB ,with its changing seat to pedal length,which means our joints are going through slightly different range of motion pretty constantly rather than the more or less same range of motion with fixed bottom bracket.
 

Charles.Plager

Recumbent Quant
Hi,
Can you engage/disengage


Hi,

Can you engage/disengage the generation? If so, I'd be curious if you think you can tell whether it's on or not (and if you're really bored, you can imagine running some sort of double-blind study where one of your kids randomly flips it but doesn't tell you... :) ).

Cheers,
Charles
 

delcrossv

New Member
Yes, you can cut draw to the

Yes, you can cut draw to the lights- IIRC it drops the drag to about 1w. (internall losses with the hub)

Good choice for a blind study- it's one that's likely to occur
teeth_smile.gif
 

delcrossv

New Member
Hi Charles-
To follow up, I



Hi Charles-
To follow up, I 've run it both on and off and haven't really noticed a difference in speed- but I'm not time-trialing either. At moderate levels of exertion like a randonne, I don't think 6 or 7 watts would make much difference over a 200 kilometer+ ride. It'd be a small fraction of a kph at identical power input and would be lost in the 'noise' in real life.
 
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