jond
Zen MBB Master
whew I can breathe again. Did you get the bag from dt recumbents. When you see the bag you’ll understand with its two mount pocket open pocket option plus cinch band.
Vosadrian's V20 Journey - Australia
- Thread starter Bentsoup
- Start date
whew I can breathe again. Did you get the bag from dt recumbents. When you see the bag you’ll understand with its two mount pocket open pocket option plus cinch band.
Frito Bandito
Zen MBB Master
When trying to put max power I just yank on the bars hard and that keeps the bike pretty straight. But I am not sure what happened when it started skipping out. I may have relaxed pulling pressure, but I'd have to give it another try. Considering todays ride, that isn't going to happen until Friday at the earliest. As for the cranks, I have Shimano 105 165mm cranks. They are pretty easy to get here, but I don't know about the 160mm cranks.
jond
Zen MBB Master
I’ll see if I have or take a new pic of paddle without bag as it’s mounted on the vendetta.
165 cranks are fairly common compared to 160. I use 165s on my DFs as I have some hip issues and shorter cranks reduces hip angles. I went from 172 to 165 on DF and performance improved for all aspects of riding for me. I would go shorter if it were available... but getting shorter than 165 in a big name crank does not seem to be easy. I think 105 shimano is the only option I see, and rare so not available from my usual online suppliers.
I could cut a set... but not sure how to arrange that.
I could cut a set... but not sure how to arrange that.
jond
Zen MBB Master
super slim
Zen MBB Master
http://www.bikesmithdesign.com/Short_Cranks/apex.html
This is a good option in US, but I don't know of any crank shortening shops in Australia!
jond
Zen MBB Master
yep Bunnings flat bar. 20x1.6x 1m. Buy two lengths it’s cheap. Make cardboard plastic sheet template for shape. Plastic p clips. Some were supplied with vendettas. 2015 and 2017.
Pics.
So I got to do some attempt at a controlled test of the change in wheels. I think they are around 1kph faster than the OEM V20 wheels. These are the wheels I compared:
* OEM 2020 V20 - Kinlin? Rims with 32 spokes F/R shallow wheel (30mm?) with GP4000S2 25mm tyres and 100gm Butyl tubes at around 90psi.
* Roval CL-50 - 50mm carbon light weight (1400gm) wide rims (16/20 spokes round spokes) with GP5000 tubeless tyres with running about 50mL sealant at around 80psi.
First onto feel. The Roval wheels feel so much nicer. They are more true and just feel nicely balanced and with the tubeless tyres running 80psi they just feel so much nicer. They roll up to 60-80kph with no vibration and you feel less stressed rolling down hills quickly as you don't feel like you are going as fast as the tyres smooth out the vibration better and my OEM wheels are a little out of true which could add vibration. But I think most of the difference is the tyres. I noticed similar when I added these wheels/tyres to my DF. Probably mostly the lower pressure and more supple tyres. I run them down to around 70psi on my DF if riding hills for some confort. I pop them up to 80-90psi if rolling fast on flat roads for a little less rolling resistance. I should also note that I experienced no issues with brake rub or anything. These wheels are pretty stiff despite low spoke count.
My ride last week (80km loop).... Light wind and 16C temp. Average power 191W. Average speed 37.3kph: https://www.strava.com/activities/5551235223
My ride today (same loop)... Light wind and 15C (but wind opposite direction, but both <5kph). Average power 194W. Average speed 38.4kph (38.7 on Garmin): https://www.strava.com/activities/5587595669
Garmin gave a difference in average speed of 1.3kph and Strava 1.1kph. So lets spit it at 1.2kph. 1.2kph faster with 3W more. I'm going to call it 1kph if the power was the same.
So does a 1kph difference (in 35-40 range) sound consistent with other experiences when going from OEM to decent aero wheels? I should note that my max speed on a steep hill near me was around 3kph faster (at around 80kph) but I got a better run into it today, so probably closer to 2-2.5kph difference.
I should note.... that I expected a bigger difference. The OEM wheels don't look like they would be that quick with lots of spokes etc. but they were not as much of an impediment as I expected.
* OEM 2020 V20 - Kinlin? Rims with 32 spokes F/R shallow wheel (30mm?) with GP4000S2 25mm tyres and 100gm Butyl tubes at around 90psi.
* Roval CL-50 - 50mm carbon light weight (1400gm) wide rims (16/20 spokes round spokes) with GP5000 tubeless tyres with running about 50mL sealant at around 80psi.
First onto feel. The Roval wheels feel so much nicer. They are more true and just feel nicely balanced and with the tubeless tyres running 80psi they just feel so much nicer. They roll up to 60-80kph with no vibration and you feel less stressed rolling down hills quickly as you don't feel like you are going as fast as the tyres smooth out the vibration better and my OEM wheels are a little out of true which could add vibration. But I think most of the difference is the tyres. I noticed similar when I added these wheels/tyres to my DF. Probably mostly the lower pressure and more supple tyres. I run them down to around 70psi on my DF if riding hills for some confort. I pop them up to 80-90psi if rolling fast on flat roads for a little less rolling resistance. I should also note that I experienced no issues with brake rub or anything. These wheels are pretty stiff despite low spoke count.
My ride last week (80km loop).... Light wind and 16C temp. Average power 191W. Average speed 37.3kph: https://www.strava.com/activities/5551235223
My ride today (same loop)... Light wind and 15C (but wind opposite direction, but both <5kph). Average power 194W. Average speed 38.4kph (38.7 on Garmin): https://www.strava.com/activities/5587595669
Garmin gave a difference in average speed of 1.3kph and Strava 1.1kph. So lets spit it at 1.2kph. 1.2kph faster with 3W more. I'm going to call it 1kph if the power was the same.
So does a 1kph difference (in 35-40 range) sound consistent with other experiences when going from OEM to decent aero wheels? I should note that my max speed on a steep hill near me was around 3kph faster (at around 80kph) but I got a better run into it today, so probably closer to 2-2.5kph difference.
I should note.... that I expected a bigger difference. The OEM wheels don't look like they would be that quick with lots of spokes etc. but they were not as much of an impediment as I expected.
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Frito Bandito
Zen MBB Master
Sounds about right from my unscientific data too switching from Zonda C17s to Bullet 50s on my DF bike. The difference between the 4000 tubed and 5000 tubeless is probably a total of 6w or so. Chuck in less spokes and deeper wheels, and there ya go. Proper 80mm wheels and/or a disc might give you another 1kph or so over stock.
jond
Zen MBB Master
Great that 16 spokes in a carbon 50 mm rim has zero issues with brake caliper.
Not the case with an aluminium rim. That same 2012 16 spoke rim with a broken spoke touched the caliper still fully open and was ridden back on the df very slowly. From that day I would not trust a 16 spoke wheel far from home.
perhaps the more modern aluminium rim on your bike is an aero improvement from mine from 2012.
my enve 6:7 set are not the new toroidal shape and are v shaped profile from 2012 but they are faster still than my two year old current shaped 50 mm yoleo 50 mm rims by 0.5 klm per hour. GPS only.
infilling to discs made another 1.5 klm per hour difference.
of course if you look and feel fast and there are other bikes around that makes 3 klm per hour difference.
decent aero wheels roval are but a deeper dish is apparently faster if rideable conditions allow.
I’m going to try covers again but only on the rear. To see how it goes in windy conditions.
Not the case with an aluminium rim. That same 2012 16 spoke rim with a broken spoke touched the caliper still fully open and was ridden back on the df very slowly. From that day I would not trust a 16 spoke wheel far from home.
perhaps the more modern aluminium rim on your bike is an aero improvement from mine from 2012.
my enve 6:7 set are not the new toroidal shape and are v shaped profile from 2012 but they are faster still than my two year old current shaped 50 mm yoleo 50 mm rims by 0.5 klm per hour. GPS only.
infilling to discs made another 1.5 klm per hour difference.
of course if you look and feel fast and there are other bikes around that makes 3 klm per hour difference.
decent aero wheels roval are but a deeper dish is apparently faster if rideable conditions allow.
I’m going to try covers again but only on the rear. To see how it goes in windy conditions.
I should note that I am sure I would have issues with the spoke count if I broke a spoke with 16 spokes.... but that has been a rare event for me in the past, so I am willing to take the risk. I can get a lift somehow if that happens. There are certainly no issues with brake rub with the spokes not broken. The first ride on the bike was with new pads in and I could get no more than 0.5mm clearance from the brake surface, and I was listening for brake rub (these wheels are noisy on braking even slightly!!) and I got none. They are a stiff wheelset and they feel great on the V20. With the tubeless tyres and lower pressures, it is so much nicer than the OEM setup... but my OEM setup had loose drive wheel spokes and I tightened them myself, and the wheel is a little out of true which could be a contributing factor. These wheels/tyres you just feel like you are gliding in comparison. I liked that feeling on the DF... but like it much more on the V20 as your body cops the vibration more.
Speed wise... 1kph is OK... would have preferred 2. I do plan to get the Yoeleo C88s... should be a little quicker. I'm not going to go full disk for normal riding. I may monocote an old wheel for occasional use when going for a KOM or race in less windy conditions.
The Roval wheels are great wheels for my DF.... they are very light (1400gm) for climbing and aero and ridable in all wind conditions (a bit of a handful in really strong wind, but ridable) and they take tubeless tyres which are fantastic (fast and comfy and much less stops for flats). I have climbing PRs on these wheels as well as flat road PRs. They also accelerate really well in a sprint and I have won sprints in racing with them. They are a perfect all rounder wheel for a DF ridden on hills and flat roads as well as racing. Before I had them I would swap between a light weight set for climbing rides and an aero heavy wheel for flat roads. These wheels are faster for both. But they are not the perfect wheel for the V20 where aero is king, and weight for climbing and acceleration are less important.... no point saving 500gm on a bike that is heading towards 15kg with a bag loaded with a bladder and spares etc. My DF is 7kg with everything on it.
Speed wise... 1kph is OK... would have preferred 2. I do plan to get the Yoeleo C88s... should be a little quicker. I'm not going to go full disk for normal riding. I may monocote an old wheel for occasional use when going for a KOM or race in less windy conditions.
The Roval wheels are great wheels for my DF.... they are very light (1400gm) for climbing and aero and ridable in all wind conditions (a bit of a handful in really strong wind, but ridable) and they take tubeless tyres which are fantastic (fast and comfy and much less stops for flats). I have climbing PRs on these wheels as well as flat road PRs. They also accelerate really well in a sprint and I have won sprints in racing with them. They are a perfect all rounder wheel for a DF ridden on hills and flat roads as well as racing. Before I had them I would swap between a light weight set for climbing rides and an aero heavy wheel for flat roads. These wheels are faster for both. But they are not the perfect wheel for the V20 where aero is king, and weight for climbing and acceleration are less important.... no point saving 500gm on a bike that is heading towards 15kg with a bag loaded with a bladder and spares etc. My DF is 7kg with everything on it.
Just weighed mine for first time with the Roval wheels and no water at 12kg. (With spare tubes/CO2/tools etc.) So with a water bottle would be close to 13kg riding weight. When I get the Brain bag with more water and the OEM wheels it will probably be around 15kg.
I went on a weight weenie mission on my DF. I was chasing PRs on the Bobbin Head West climb. Saving 1kg would save about 10-15 seconds. I got my PR down to 8:11.... was aiming for sub 8. My bike was around 7kg and I emptied my water bottle before the climb (there is a bubbler at the top of the climb) This was just prior to COVID lockdown and my usual Bobbo group disbanded for several months... I have unfinished business there!! But it will take months of several 10 minute climbs a week to get back to the form (and rider weight <70kg)) for me to do that..... 340W average for 8 minutes. I have no similar intentions for the V20.... yet!!
I went on a weight weenie mission on my DF. I was chasing PRs on the Bobbin Head West climb. Saving 1kg would save about 10-15 seconds. I got my PR down to 8:11.... was aiming for sub 8. My bike was around 7kg and I emptied my water bottle before the climb (there is a bubbler at the top of the climb) This was just prior to COVID lockdown and my usual Bobbo group disbanded for several months... I have unfinished business there!! But it will take months of several 10 minute climbs a week to get back to the form (and rider weight <70kg)) for me to do that..... 340W average for 8 minutes. I have no similar intentions for the V20.... yet!!
jond
Zen MBB Master
340 watts for eight minutes at 70 kg. Woh. I feel like Alexi sayles fat bastard.
I suppose you’re related to that footy commentator too with unfinished business.
beast mode for you. I’ve signed up for 12 x 12 Sydney motorway. 85 klm time trial. Come and beat this old man up.
the brain bag is very light. Flat bar too. And will help the aero.
I suppose you’re related to that footy commentator too with unfinished business.
beast mode for you. I’ve signed up for 12 x 12 Sydney motorway. 85 klm time trial. Come and beat this old man up.
the brain bag is very light. Flat bar too. And will help the aero.
Just got the brain bag. ANy ideas for supply of the P-clips?
That 340W is my best effort ever for that time. Think I was around 67kg at the time. I was consistently around the 320-330 mark (for around 8:20), but found something more that day. My brother has an 8:13 for that climb and I was going all out to pip him. Got him by 2 seconds!! By golly it hurt though!! He lives in QLD now so limited change for him to come take it back!! I'm not a natural climber. I am better at sprint efforts. Actually most of my KOMs are the 1-3 minutes. Over 5 minutes max effort for me is not where I do as well... but I do OK at sub-threshold for longer periods.
Whats the 12 X 12? Googled it but no luck.
That 340W is my best effort ever for that time. Think I was around 67kg at the time. I was consistently around the 320-330 mark (for around 8:20), but found something more that day. My brother has an 8:13 for that climb and I was going all out to pip him. Got him by 2 seconds!! By golly it hurt though!! He lives in QLD now so limited change for him to come take it back!! I'm not a natural climber. I am better at sprint efforts. Actually most of my KOMs are the 1-3 minutes. Over 5 minutes max effort for me is not where I do as well... but I do OK at sub-threshold for longer periods.
Whats the 12 X 12? Googled it but no luck.
Found this clip at a marine shop up the road from me. Might grab some and see it that works:
https://www.bluebottlemarine.com/products/tube-clamp-19mm-black.html
https://www.bluebottlemarine.com/products/tube-clamp-19mm-black.html
