Wrist/arm Discomfort

[WhiteSilvio]

I am wondering if others are experiencing the same thing I am with wrist and forearm discomfort after riding for say half and hour or more?

I am finding that while riding my Silvio for the above mentioned time I am experiencing considerable discomfort in my wrists and forearm and even the upper arm. It gets to a stage where my wrists are so sore that even changing gear with the STI levers causes concern.

If I stop and have a break my arms recover fairly well but the discomfort all comes back again if I am not very careful to keep my upper body relaxed and keep the "grip level" on the handlebars to a lowish level.

Making an "effort" say uphill or when trying to stay with other riders, or a combination of these, where the upper body is in use, will bring on this discomfort. Is this just me or do others have this trouble, or have had this trouble?

This is something newish since I have started riding slightly longer. This morning was like this; I rode for around 2 and a half hours all up, with a short pitstop at around an hour and of course a coffee break before riding home.

I am wondering if my "setup" needs to be adjusted.

John.

 

[Kamatu]

NOT A DOCTOR!

But, are you experiencing this in any other activity, even to a minor extent? If it is only on the Silvio under the conditions you mentioned, then I'd guess setup.

Only reason I asked is that looking at your avatar, you look like you might have a few years on you and I have a certain condition the docs check on me for. So far there is nothing they can do about it (numbness down arms from elbow to fingertip on the bottom (pinkie) side that kills feeling for pinkie and ring finger. It is a sign of a serious nerve problem of some sort that can happen as you get older and that I don't have. No, it isn't carpal, it is just I seem to be prone to be getting bad pinched nerves in the elbow (and I know what is causing that one). Biggest problem is that when it starts, I have to quit doing any reasonable amount of manual labor with my hands for a couple of days or it will continue to spread until my entire hand goes numb.

 

[WhiteSilvio]

Hi Kamatu,
I don't experience this problem while doing anything else.

For the purpose of the exercise I am 53. Whilst not young, it does seem to be a popular figure ( or there abouts ) for people who ride Cruzbikes.

Maybe I should post some sideon shots of me sitting on the bike, this may throw some light on the subject for someone.

John

 

[Peder Torgersen]

On my upright before I got a recumbent I also had experienced pain and discomfort in my wrists. The pain and knobbiness would come very early in the ride with an upright. The angel the wrists are in riding position is important. On an upright the wrists are often 90° to your forearms which is not good. On a recumbent they can be straighter. Blood circulation is better for your arms and legs on a recumbent it’s easier for your heart to pump the blood around in your body in a recumbent position then in an upright position. I have a Sofrider V1 now it takes a very long ride before I feel some discomfort in my wrists. Even on a long ride on my Sofrider the discomfort has not bothered me like it did on an upright which was directly painful. After more practice you also have an option of riding without using your arms! Then they have a chance of resting. You can also let your legs do most of the work try to relax your upper body. That will be easier after more riding. Adjusting the riding positon may also help?

Peder

 

[John Tolhurst]

WhiteSilvio wrote: Maybe I should post some sideon shots of me sitting on the bike

please to check wrist and arm angles and to check if you are gripping a straight or curved section of the bar.

 

[Mark B]

I have it, too, on Silvio II. I'm not convinced it's the bike, though. I have soreness in the fingers of my left hand and my right wrist gets stiff and sore after about 40 miles on the bike. I never had this on Silvio I, though and not on silvio II for a while, so I think it's something else. I've lost a fair amount of weight this year and it could be just part of my body going through changes. I'm going to change my handlebar angle just a titch this morning to see if it makes any difference.

Mark

 

[defjack]

Heres my set up I dont get any wrist pain at all.I cant ride an upright for more than 5 miles without some pain so my wrists are not that great. Jack

 

[rearengine]

I think you guys have your hands to high I'm useing this thread as an excuse to post a pic of my bike. I really don't have arm or rist pain though..Did 30 miles the other day. Big deal huh!!! take care Bill

 

[WhiteSilvio]

Okay these are a couple of pics of me on the bike. I hope they show enough for the experts to make comment.

The handlebars are Gary Origin 8 'bars. Sorry the pictures are a little dark, but it was on dusk when I was able to get my wife to help with the photography and the flash really only highlights the near subjects/objects.

Hope this helps.

My last two rides were 55km over a hilly terrain and 60 km over flatter terrain. Surprisingly the flatter run seemed to cause more problems, but then again they were on two consecutive morning rides, Friday and Saturday, so maybe I was just compounding the problem.

The flatter ride was on a run where quite a lot of fairly serious DF riders gather. (not much other than DF riders in this part of the world. Didn't see another recumbent all ride.) I was quietly rolling along on the flats doing 26-28kph when a group of 4 riders came past. They were rolling at 32-34kph and jumped on their wheel. This was good as they were going the same general route as me. That lasted about 10 minutes, by which time we were running along the waterfront of the bay (Moreton Bay, Brisbane), pleasant and deceptively flat! Anyway at this point another faster group went by and I wondered how fast they were going? Well there's only one way to find out so I made an effort and with not much difficulty caught them up. They were averaging about 38-40kph and I stayed with them for a couple of kilometres until they decided to pull over to the side of the road and regroup, wait for others, have a rest, who knows, but I lost my tow. But while it lasted it was fun. Sorry this has digressed into a bit of a ride report.

I rode for another 5ks or so and stopped to catch up with another group I have ridden with over past weekends, so I had a rest and got my wrists arms feeling more normal again, before setting off home, via the coffee shop.

John.

 

[defjack]

It looks like your grip is pretty high up on the bars.You might try rotating the bars so your grip is on the end .You can also try moving the shifters down.It should be easy to shft with one finger. Jack

 

[WhiteSilvio]

Jack wrote: It looks like your grip is pretty high up on the bars.You might try rotating the bars so your grip is on the end .You can also try moving the shifters down.It should be easy to shift with one finger. Jack

Hi Jack,
So you're suggesting rotating the 'bars anticlockwise as you look at the 'bars from the "drive side" of the bike (as seen in my side on shot in my previous post). This would then make the ends of the 'bars "more vertical". Have I understood what you mean correctly?

Just as an aside I'm able to shift with one finger now, but I guess if the bars are more vertical the STI levers should follow them around as you suggest, in order to maintain the "one finger" operation, which I find very useful.

Regards, John.

 

[defjack]

Yes you want the bars more vertical.I would play around with the adjustments and see if it helps. Jack

 

[Kamatu]

defjack wrote: Yes you want the bars more vertical.I would play around with the adjustments and see if it helps. Jack

Hmmm, I go the immediate impression on the shot from behind that it looked like too much reach and he should rotate the other way some (bottom of the bar end back towards rider). Of course, when John T gets here, he will tell you.

If you don't want to wait, go ahead and try either way about 1/8th of a turn. I wouldn't move anything else if you can avoid it until you find the comfortable spot, it looks like it wouldn't hurt to be a bit awkward on the shifting and brakes to test.

 

[Doug Burton]

Hi John,

Lemme ask you...

Do you have enough leg clearance to lower the bars a little? In other words, can you shorten the TFT distance between the bars and the pivot clamp?

I have learned that the entire arm is a system, and having the elbows bent can transfer stresses to the wrists. Your elbows are bent more than mine are, and several folks have questioned whether mine are too bent...

I think you are grasping the bars correctly; you have the brifters up a little so you can grasp the apex of the curve in the bars. That's how I have mine adjusted, but I have the "top" section of the forward bend horizontal and parallel with the road.

This part of the adjustment is a little itchy...

Best,

Doug

 

[WhiteSilvio]

Well hello everyone!
I guess I wasn't expecting quite the response that has happened. I thought maybe one or two would wade in with some advice, but I am overwhelmed!

So I have understood what you are saying correctly, Jack. I'll absorb the vertical bar theory and make some adjustments and sit on the bike and see how it feels.

Hi Doug. Yes I do have a little room to shorten the TFT and move the 'bars away from me.

A little more information: I recently lowered the TFT Pivot block down on the steerer tube by swapping the spacers around so they are above the TFT pivot block. I thought that was a good move as it lowered the 'bars about 25 mm or so. I found that better, but maybe that has actually increased the bend in my arm just a little, so along the lines you are suggesting Doug, I have been able to shorten the distance between the 'bars and the TFT Pivot block by about 12 to 15 mm. I think that I have enough clearance between the knees and the 'bars, but I haven't tried it out yet. But I think it will be okay. I might even have room to go a few millimetres further forward.

Sitting on the bike and seeing how the grips felt I also rotated them so the ends of the bars are just a little flatter, but only a couple of degrees. They feel comfortable enough with the first bent part of the GO8 'bars roughly flat (horizontal), the way you appear to have your 'bars set up on the MS ride photo.

This is the bit of the setup with the Silvio that I find a little difficult. I realize from my DF days that setup is pretty sensitive. I had that amply demonstrated on a ride one day when I had done a minor adjustment on seat height and didn't tighten the seat tube properly. I think I was a little nervous of damaging the carbon-fibre seat tube. Well, during a ride the seat sank 10 or 15 mm and I ended up with a sore back and no power.

So I'm surmising the settings on the Silvio are probably as sensitive. Is that that right, John (T)?

Unfortunately I don't have a friendly Recumbent bike shop in the area, and although my LBS is pretty good they are far from experts on recumbents, particularly MBB recumbents.

So I am still open to suggestions but now I've made an adjustment I really have to try it out for a while and see what the effect is.
I'll see what happens and how the wrists/arms feel.
Thanks to all for your input. Keep it coming.

John.

 

[Mark B]

WhiteSilvio wrote: I recently lowered the TFT Pivot block down on the steerer tube by swapping the spacers around so they are above the TFT pivot block. I thought that was a good move as it lowered the 'bars about 25 mm or so. I found that better, but maybe that has actually increased the bend in my arm just a little, so along the lines you are suggesting Doug, I have been able to shorten the distance between the 'bars and the TFT Pivot block by about 12 to 15 mm. I think that I have enough clearance between the knees and the 'bars, but I haven't tried it out yet. But I think it will be okay. I might even have room to go a few millimetres further forward.

This is how I set Silvio II up. I have the handlebars so they just clear my knees. In fact, since I switched from my sandals to my road shoes, my knees tick the bars every once in a while. My TFT is probably 1/4" shorter on the top end than Silvio I was.

WhiteSilvio wrote: Sitting on the bike and seeing how the grips felt I also rotated them so the ends of the bars are just a little flatter, but only a couple of degrees. They feel comfortable enough with the first bent part of the GO8 'bars roughly flat (horizontal), the way you appear to have your 'bars set up on the MS ride photo.

I had mine set up like that, but I noticed my wrists were always bent at an odd angle, so I rotated my bars forward slightly, so when holding onto the drops, My wrists are closer to a neutral position. I haven't tested this setup, yet.

WhiteSilvio wrote: This is the bit of the setup with the Silvio that I find a little difficult. <snip>
So I'm surmising the settings on the Silvio are probably as sensitive. Is that that right, John (T)?

I must have gotten lucky on Silvio I, because it was all good, all the time. Silvio II is good, until I get out 40 miles, or so, then I get the issue in my right wrist. I just need to mess with the adjustment a little more and one thing I believe I will try is to put one of the carbon fiber spacers back underneatht the TFT block. I might start with the skinny one, first and see how that goes.

Mark

 

[WhiteSilvio]

Mark B wrote: I must have gotten lucky on Silvio I, because it was all good, all the time. Silvio II is good, until I get out 40 miles, or so, then I get the issue in my right wrist. I just need to mess with the adjustment a little more and one thing I believe I will try is to put one of the carbon fiber spacers back underneath the TFT block. I might start with the skinny one, first and see how that goes.

Mark

So you'll be effectively raising the handlebars a little. You seemed fairly adamant that you prefered lower handlebars, but that hasn't worked out quite the way you wanted. Do you feel your wrist soreness originated from this change? The 'bars being lower didn't give the effect you expected? More information please.

John

 

[Mark B]

WhiteSilvio wrote:

Mark B wrote: I must have gotten lucky on Silvio I, because it was all good, all the time. Silvio II is good, until I get out 40 miles, or so, then I get the issue in my right wrist. I just need to mess with the adjustment a little more and one thing I believe I will try is to put one of the carbon fiber spacers back underneath the TFT block. I might start with the skinny one, first and see how that goes.

Mark

So you'll be effectively raising the handlebars a little. You seemed fairly adamant that you prefered lower handlebars, but that hasn't worked out quite the way you wanted. Do you feel your wrist soreness originated from this change? The 'bars being lower didn't give the effect you expected? More information please.

John

I'm mostly raising the bar a little to get away from hitting my knees on it. I don't know, now you've made me think about it, maybe I should just extend the TFT and pull the bar back a little. The wrist thing I feel will be managed with the bar adjustment I made. I'll know more this weekend.

Mark

 

[Mark B]

As a follow-up on this, rotating the handlebar forward just a little seemed to make a big difference, but I'm still not completely convinced it's solely an adjustment issue. Last week, on one of my commute rides to work, it was really chilly. I had my glove liners on, but my fingers still got cold and.... I got the stiffness/soreness I get on longish Silvio rides. I probably have the beginning of some joint issues that are affected by cold and long periods of time in one position.

Mark