How good are patches?

[ed72]

My bet is replacing the punctured tube for a new tube would be just as not fun. But think if you had a dyna-plug it might have been as simple as push-pull- go.

Actually, much easier to replace a tube. No sealant to clean out of the inside tire walls and the biggie for me, no stem tubeless valve stem to unscrew with frozen hands. Admittedly, some are easier to take off than others and my left hand is often nearly useless. Once the tubeless tire has a tube in it, they can still be hard to seat. So, cartridges are often used to facilitate the seating of the bead. That is never needed on tubed tires from my experience. In all, I see little advantage and a lot of downside to tubeless.

The dynaplug could be a game changer, though.

When Schwalbe Pro Ones first came out, they were absolutely horrendous. I understand they have fixed them. I used to get slit cuts 5-20 mm along the casing threads and had to boot them or replace the tire. Bad experience. I don't like riding a booted tire 100+ miles from home. This happened almost every brevet or about every two weeks. I went thru 5 of the 6 I bought. Then, I was using Compass Bon Jons. I had like 20 flats in one day out in Wyoming...casing issue. I put 28 mm Conti GP4000si on and rode the rest of the way across the USA w/o a flat. I had one flat last year. So, I'll stick with what works for me. Conti GP5000 with latex tubes, for now.

 

[burando]

Can anybody actually say that they have had a patched repaired tube where the failed patch has blown the tire off the rim?

No, but I did once have a tube explosion that blew part of the rim off the wheel. Or a rim failure that allowed the tube to explode. Either way, it was loud enough that people ducked behind cars thinking it was a gunshot. Myself included.

 

[ed72]

No, but I did once have a tube explosion that blew part of the rim off the wheel. Or a rim failure that allowed the tube to explode. Either way, it was loud enough that people ducked behind cars thinking it was a gunshot. Myself included.

I have blow tires off rims. It is about like a 12 ga shotgun blast.

I have had many defective tubes right out of the box. Bad valves, bad connection of the valve to the tube, and with Schwalbe UL tubes, small pinhole leaks at the seams. This is one reason that I would take a known good tube that had been patched.

Having been to the rubber plantations in Asia and seen the manufacturing of medical products over there, I can only imagine the lousy processes for something as cheap as a bike tube.

In fact, I test all new tubes that are going to accompany me on any sort of long distance remote trip or adventure. Once burned, twice shy.

 

[tiltmaniac]

I've had a tube explode as well, though as a result of rim brakes causing too much thermal expansion.
It sounded like an explosion, and scared the bejeeez out of me!
Thankfully, this happened 30 or so seconds after the descent was done, so the net result want so bad.

Amusingly (?) the failure was nowhere near the patched part of the tube!

 

[trplay]

Here we go, facts are facts. During this weekends race I had four of these little self-repairing patches (photo) and didn't even know it until I got home. That is four flats I didn't have to fix on the road. Tubeless is working great for me. Just before the start I swapped all four of our tires over to the Trucker sealant Jason recommends. This meant four tire changes- no problem, all the tires jumped on the rims and seated with little effort. I think a lot of the tubeless mounting problems goes away with practice.

 

[hurri47]

Patches are great, but I wouldn't expect the glue to work if it is raining and everything is soaking wet.
Anyone here had success patching a tube in the rain (or snow)?

What are you doing riding in rain and snow?

-Dan

 

[velocio]

I have had many defective tubes right out of the box. Bad valves, bad connection of the valve to the tube, and with Schwalbe UL tubes, small pinhole leaks at the seams. This is one reason that I would take a known good tube that had been patched.

This is my experience as well. I started to write a post in this thread saying the same thing a few days ago, but ended up deleting it so as not to stir the pot with crazy claims, i.e. tubes are most likely to fail when you remove them from their box to install for the first time. I'll always choose to rely on a tube that's patched, but otherwise proven in use, than take pot luck with a new tube, given how often new tubes have some manufacturing variance that's not good for reliability/durability.

A related example I read about in the peer reviewed Journal of Operations Research years ago is a study showing that replacing even relatively old light bulbs before they fail decreases the mean time to failure; i.e. bulbs that have been used for a while can be expected to last longer on average than if you replace them with new bulbs, since a % of new bulbs will fail immediately or very quickly due to manufacturing variances. Counter-intuitive, but old bulbs last longer than new bulbs ... I believe this also partly explains the common lament that "they don't make them like they used to!"

-Jack K.
Raleigh, NC

 

[ed72]

This is my experience as well. I started to write a post in this thread saying the same thing a few days ago, but ended up deleting it so as not to stir the pot with crazy claims, i.e. tubes are most likely to fail when you remove them from their box to install for the first time. I'll always choose to rely on a tube that's patched, but otherwise proven in use, than take pot luck with a new tube, given how often new tubes have some manufacturing variance that's not good for reliability/durability.

A related example I read about in the peer reviewed Journal of Operations Research years ago is a study showing that replacing even relatively old light bulbs before they fail decreases the mean time to failure; i.e. bulbs that have been used for a while can be expected to last longer on average than if you replace them with new bulbs, since a % of new bulbs will fail immediately or very quickly due to manufacturing variances. Counter-intuitive, but old bulbs last longer than new bulbs ... I believe this also partly explains the common lament that "they don't make them like they used to!"

-Jack K.
Raleigh, NC

There is a lot what you say.

We used to beat the crap out of and half bake Mil-Spec junk to death before QC would allow it to be shipped and put into DoD stuff. I did quality engineering type work back in the day.

I am a little lazy when it comes to local rides, I just bring two tubes and patches. One of the tubes is ALWAYS a repaired one and it is the first one to go into the repair.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bathtub_curve

 

[Bill K]

What are you doing riding in rain and snow?

I have to do my "escape from work" ride, no matter what!

 

[ed72]

Three key points in Jobst Brandt's post. Removal of the top layer of the tube area to be patched using the sand paper is essential, wait until the "glue" has dried, and don't ride a patched tube immediately. Failure to scratch off the top layer is the main reason patches don't adhere, the top layer has the mold release agent from when the tube was manufactured. Mold release agent is "slippery stuff"

When I used to do loaded touring, I'd replace the tube on a flat AND also patch the bad tube if the weather was decent.

If I lived in Goathead country or in areas with glass on the road, I'd be tubeless. But, I generally average 5,000 miles between flats. So, I'm sticking with tubes.

https://www.sheldonbrown.com/brandt/patching.html