My Very First Recumbent is a V20

[Frito Bandito]

SRAM Force AXS short cage works with the Shimano R7000 105 53/36t chainring and 11/34t Ultegra 12-speed cassette like a charm with the 118L KMC chain. However, the AXS front derailleur is at the furthest limit with the 53t so the only way I can go faster is to pedal faster

 

[cpml123]

Is the 105 11 speed? So I guess 11 speed chainrings work with 12 speed chain?

 

[vosadrian]

I would like to try 53-11 on a segment near me.... I don't need it much, but every now and then!!

 

[Frito Bandito]

Is the 105 11 speed? So I guess 11 speed chainrings work with 12 speed chain?

Yes, it does work with a 12-speed. I haven’t had any problems at all with it and there doesn’t seem to be any excessive wear on the teeth, but I don’t have any idea how long it should or will last. 10,000 kilometers so far before the change and the 52t teeth were still in good shape. I’ll keep the 52t just in case the 53t turns to be too big

 

[Frito Bandito]

I would like to try 53-11 on a segment near me.... I don't need it much, but every now and then!!

Gonna be fun trying it out. If I switch to a SRAM hub and cassette I’ll have access to the 10t that SRAM’s cassettes come with. I’m not sure how much faster the 53/10 will be than the 72kph I got with a tailwind and short descent with the 52/11 at 120rpms. 75kph?

I am also swapping the C15 50mm and 80mm Bullets out for wider C17 35mm Sciroccos. The wider tires will be more comfortable and maybe faster, but I’ll also be able to quickly install the front disc on it for when the conditions are right to try a top speed run.

 

[vosadrian]

53/10 will be much longer gearing..... over 10% faster at the same cadence (80kph??)... but it will be harder to push the gear over at higher speed, so you may not end up that much faster.

 

[Frito Bandito]

I think you are right. Throw in that the conditions where I did the 72kph are practically gone for the year since the Summer winds blow the opposite direction from where that slope is. I might get lucky by catching one or more of the hurricanes during Summer, but that is even less dependable or possible than the numerous cold fronts we get from China that I have been riding in.

 

[Frito Bandito]

Might be time for a new chain. It has about 13,000km and makes a very obnoxious sound when on the 53t front and 34t rear. Also, it might be time to buy a 55t crankset if I can find 1 with 165, or possibly 170mm arms. During my last ride there was an absolutely MASSIVE tailwind that had me spinning out and hoping for 1 more gear in small sections where I reached up to 65kph for a few seconds. The main problem is that in the gusts the bike felt it was skipping like a rock across the pavement partly caused by my rpms being too high. I think that with a 55t chainring the lower rpms would have made it much more stable while still being able to put out enough power, and I wouldn't have been constantly making corrections to avoid a crash. For almost 11km it felt like the sudden twitches I occasionally had when first taking to the MBB system. All that adrenaline, energy, excitement and terror wore off by the time I coasted all the way up the hill at Horikiri station, and despite a tailwind, I finished out the last 10km at a low speed despite the tailwind. What a comical rush that ride was.

Very Windy Horikiri Sprint Upriver - Andrew C.'s 45.9 km bike ride

-- myWindsock Report -- CdA: 0.233 Weather Impact: 9.2% Headwind: 59% @ 39.4-56.9km/h Longest Headwind: 31m 12s Air Speed: 35.9km/h Temp: 24.7-25.5°C Precip: 0% @ 0 Inch/hr -- END --

www.strava.com

 

[John Formsma]

Might be time for a new chain??? With that amount of wear, you'll probably need a new cassette also. I replace my chains around 5,000 kilometers so the cassette will last longer. I've used the same cassette for thousands and thousands of miles. I've had the same cassette for two road bikes, and now 9,100 miles on the recumbent. I'd guess at least 45,000 miles.

I'd agree that a bigger chainring would definitely help with spinning out. I don't know that I'd want to be swapping around crank arm length, though. I'd want to stay with the same size arm to keep the pedal motion the same.

Also, you don't generally want to run big-big combinations of gears (or little-little either). That's called cross-chaining. It reduces chain life.

 

[Jeffers]

You must be getting strong to need a 55 tooth chainring. Think I would stay with whatever crank length you're using now, and not go shorter. You might miss the torque you get from a longer crank while pushing that 55 tooth chainring.

 

[Frito Bandito]

Might be time for a new chain??? With that amount of wear, you'll probably need a new cassette also. I replace my chains around 5,000 kilometers so the cassette will last longer. I've used the same cassette for thousands and thousands of miles. I've had the same cassette for two road bikes, and now 9,100 miles on the recumbent. I'd guess at least 45,000 miles.

I'd agree that a bigger chainring would definitely help with spinning out. I don't know that I'd want to be swapping around crank arm length, though. I'd want to stay with the same size arm to keep the pedal motion the same.

Also, you don't generally want to run big-big combinations of gears (or little-little either). That's called cross-chaining. It reduces chain life.

I hear ya John. I stay off cross chaining as much as possible on all of my bikes, but especially the V20. I am all for getting as much mileage out of my gear as possible to save money and the hassle of changing them out. I checked the chain stretch with a chain tool and it is only at .5, not .7 yet so while it is time to change it it could be worse. It does show that WD40 for my riding conditions (dry and relatively dust free) works fine, but I am thinking of going with Silca's Synergetic wet lube if I can find it here. It costs only 2 watts more in drivetrain friction than the best waxes on the market, and doesn't wash off as easily with water as WD40 does. I have been relubing every 200-300km with WD40 on all of my bikes for the last 6 years, but I am not ready to jump into the waxing club just yet. I've heard of riders using Synergetic Wet Lube every 1000km with great success, so I figure I can get away with 500km between lubes with my riding conditions. I have already bought a new 138L Shimano 12-speed chain, I just gotta get off my butt to do it.

 

[Jeffers]

"Wow, 138L Shimano 12-speed chain"
I heard V20's needed a little more than one 116 link chain for replacement.
138 links should do it with one chain. Right?

 

[Frito Bandito]

You must be getting strong to need a 55 tooth chainring. Think I would stay with whatever crank length you're using now, and not go shorter. You might miss the torque you get from a longer crank while pushing that 55 tooth chainring.

I'd love to stay with my 165mm Shimano R7000 105 cranks because I have my 4iiii power meter on the left arm, but Shimano doesn't offer a 55t for this model. Maybe aftermarket? So, I likely need to get a whole new crankset. Luckily, 165mm cranks are quite common here so I might be able to find a cheapish set.

I think it is safe to say I have finally surpassed or at least matched my DF FTP of 247w (Strava calculation) on my V20, and I could stick with the 53t. However.... and this really irks me....

After having 1 ride flagged 3 times after a recent ride that I took a few KOMs, probably by a Japanese Strava athlete I took the KOMs from...
AND

A recent exchange with 1 of the 3 triathletes who team up and take KOMs (totally legal) in which he took a passive aggressive swipe at me I have been wanting to alter my usual training rides from just going after KOMs willynilly during my usual 25km sprints to conserving my energy and making full on efforts for specific KOMs on days when the conditions are right for an attempt. The following 10 KOMs, I missed all by less than 10 seconds, and for far too long during that ride I was hoping for 1 more gear. Not only that, I had to slow down because 1 of the gates was clogged, losing at least 30 seconds.
8,7,7,5,5,5,1,6,3,3

I don't really want to be that guy, but now I want to put the KOMs so far out of reach that a triathlon bike and gaining an extra 40 watts still isn't going to be enough to get them back regardless of the wind conditions.

 

[Frito Bandito]

"Wow, 138L Shimano 12-speed chain"
I heard V20's needed a little more than one 116 link chain for replacement.
138 links should do it with one chain. Right?

Yep. My V20 is 118L. This one isn't SilTec, but for about $55 it is pretty good. If I recall correctly CN-M8100 is Ultegra level. With Sil-Tec is about $75 or so in my LBS

 

[vosadrian]

I use the UFO drip wax. I can't say if it is quicker and I think it does not last as long... but it is very clean to handle the chain, and in the case of the V20 and a front flat... you need to handle the chain a lot... so I prefer a clean chain!

I find cross chaining to not be so baad on the V20.... because the chain length is longer than a road bike, the chain angles are less even in full large/large combo. I regularly go large/large to go over a quick pinch to save dropping to the small ring. My chain wear on the V20 seems lower than my DF road bikes... could be the longer chain, so the wear spreads over more links? I think the chain gets less dirty from dust thrown up by the wheels on less clean roads also.

 

[Frito Bandito]

I use the UFO drip wax. I can't say if it is quicker and I think it does not last as long... but it is very clean to handle the chain, and in the case of the V20 and a front flat... you need to handle the chain a lot... so I prefer a clean chain!

I find cross chaining to not be so baad on the V20.... because the chain length is longer than a road bike, the chain angles are less even in full large/large combo. I regularly go large/large to go over a quick pinch to save dropping to the small ring. My chain wear on the V20 seems lower than my DF road bikes... could be the longer chain, so the wear spreads over more links? I think the chain gets less dirty from dust thrown up by the wheels on less clean roads also.

Yep, I think you are right on about the V20's chain staying cleaner. Just another "pro" for owning a V20. I am also quite careful about pedaling under load when changing gears. This likely helps in reducing wear on the gears. I wish my large/large wasn't so noisy though. Luckily the max climb I really get is about 10m in about 200m of distance travelled, so I can simply stay on the big ring all day. My mates are planning a trip to Mt. Fuji again so I gotta keep the 2x system for a bit longer. After that, I am going to a single 55t for my river runs. As it is with the 53t, I am always on the small end of the cassette, so this will spread the wear over the bigger gears on it.

 

[John Formsma]

I hear ya John. I stay off cross chaining as much as possible on all of my bikes, but especially the V20. I am all for getting as much mileage out of my gear as possible to save money and the hassle of changing them out. I checked the chain stretch with a chain tool and it is only at .5, not .7 yet so while it is time to change it it could be worse. It does show that WD40 for my riding conditions (dry and relatively dust free) works fine, but I am thinking of going with Silca's Synergetic wet lube if I can find it here. It costs only 2 watts more in drivetrain friction than the best waxes on the market, and doesn't wash off as easily with water as WD40 does. I have been relubing every 200-300km with WD40 on all of my bikes for the last 6 years, but I am not ready to jump into the waxing club just yet. I've heard of riders using Synergetic Wet Lube every 1000km with great success, so I figure I can get away with 500km between lubes with my riding conditions. I have already bought a new 138L Shimano 12-speed chain, I just gotta get off my butt to do it.

Regular WD-40, or the bike lube they now make?

My 11-speed chains have never shown much wear. I've heard somewhere that they do wear out, but without showing the typical wear of the chains for fewer gears.

I support you in these KOM efforts! I hope you can make them all unbeatable! Were you able to unflag the KOM?

I've also thought about going with a single chainring setup on mine. Unfortunately, that thought came to me right after I bought a new front shifter. Lol. If I'd thought of single chainring before, I probably would've switched over. Right now, I have a 11-25 cassette with 52x36 chainrings. I haven't done any hard calculations, but I think I could do OK with a 53 chainring and 11-36 cassette. Most of my riding is all flat, so I'd seldom need the larger cog. Only for group charity rides, and I do maybe two of those a year. The 53x11 would give me all the gear I'd need except for one segment that's mostly downhill.

If you go to 55t chainring, the chain will need to be a bit longer to use the bigger cogs. But you probably know that already.

 

[Jeffers]

I went to a single chainring earlier this year, but had to put the front derailleur back on to keep the chain from falling off.
Worked out OK though as I was able to adjust the limit screw far enough to make a chain guide out of the front derailleur.
50 x 25 is my lowest gear now with a one by.

 

[vosadrian]

WIsh I could go 1X... most of the riding I do on the V20 is on the large ring.... but unfortunately I live at the bottom of a steep hill, so the first 500m are >10% and typically done on 36-32. There are a few similar hills I need to get up to leave my area to get to the flatter roads, so I can't really do without a granny gear. I also could use a bit more top end to get some KOMs. I have a few long shallow hills near me where I am topping out at around 65kph pedaling. Would be great to get up over 70 and still be able to pedal. I think the KOMs are on TT bikes with 55/56 front.

 

[Frito Bandito]

Jeffers, so far I haven't had the chain fall off yet, but that could be because the FD is still on, and my cranks are still a 2x system. I checked my usual sites for 55t cranks but no luck yet. If I can find a 55t crankset I might have to improvise just to keep the chain from falling off.

Vos, you are probably right that they are using a 55t or larger front. Either that or those young bucks aren't out of their element with +120rpms even with a big tailwind. I can't say I hate climbing, but I'd probably drive to the flat roads if I were you just to avoid the hills. I know the V20 can handle hills, but I didn't buy it for that lol. Being able to pedal at 70kph would be just fine though.

Weather forecast now shows a 25kph tailwind on Saturday so I'll keep my eye on that. Hopefully it will increase, but being the weekend means it'll likely be crowded and the gates will be up.

1 more option I have is dropping the Shimano 11-34 for a new set of wheels with a SRAM driver and a 10-33t cassette.