Shine on you crazy diamond

ratz

Wielder of the Rubber Mallet
Disappointing but not unexpected exchange with support about the performance curves of the Gemini lights.

Might have been simpler to say; we mass produce our stuff with a low quality standards in china and can't be bothered to test run times because even if we did product variability would make the results useless. So your guess is as good as ours.

*sigh*

Guess I need to figure out a way to do some runtime tests. Leaving the light on is easy figuring out when it turned off not so much; anyone got an old oscilloscope laying around unused?

From: Gemini Lights <support@gemini-lights.com>
Subject: Re: runtimes but Percent level and batter capacity?
Date:
April 18, 2016 at 2:11:28 AM CDT
To: Bob Pankratz <xxxxxxxxxxxx@icloud.com>

Hi Bob,
Thanks for your message.
I’m afraid we don’t have more information other than what is provided on the product page for the Duo. For your reference the Low / Med / High (300, 900, 1500L) settings relate to 20%, 60%, 100% power levels. They are not exactly 10% increments of lumens as this is extremely hard to achieve because there are many variables that affect lumen output. They are merely provided as a guide to the ten power levels available.
DUO 2-CELL
HIGH 1500 1HR 30MINS
MED 900 2HR 10MINS
LOW 300 6HR 30MINS
DUO 4-CELL
HIGH 1500 3HR
MED 900 4HR 20MINS
LOW 300 13HR

--

Chris
Gemini Lights


Website | Facebook


On Apr 14, 2016, at 1:19 PM, Bob Pankratz <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@icloud.com> wrote:

Hello,

We just received our qty 2, Duo Light Sets. I'm looking for more detailed documentation on each Levels Run time based on the size of Battery in mAh. We will be using these for UltraCycling and during training season it is most useful to create a laminated cheat card to document the runs times for each level for each size battery. This allows use to pick the right mode based on the weather, the length of ride and the various battery sizes (and weights) that we have on hand. Also it would be good to know if your 10 levels are truly 10% jump on the spectrum from what Lowest Level Lumens up to the 1500 max.
 

RojoRacing

Donut Powered Wise-guy
Did you order your lights from ActionLed? Jim over there has always been extremely helpful with me. I've even gone as far as to help design and produce early prototype wide angle lenses with Jim to push Gloworm in the right direction. Similar to my involvement here with CruzBike. You may want to give him a call and ask him personally.

I really think Gloworm performance has always been a step ahead of Gemini with Gloworms wiring being its only weak point. If only Gloworm would go wireless remote you'd have the do all light.

Also if anyone is interested in purchasing lights and they can be found on ActionLed I highly recommend getting them through Jim. He doesn't support me in any way, I just have had nothing but good experiences with him over the last 3 years.
 

ratz

Wielder of the Rubber Mallet
Did you order your lights from ActionLed? Jim over there has always been extremely helpful with me.

I did and I can check with them. Just was hoping that the actual manufacturer would test things. It's not like runtime matters with lights or anything. Especially when making the decision about whether to haul two pounds of batteries.... Perhaps the middle supplier is really the better touch point here. Thanks for the tip.

Per the normal; on this past weekend ride most of the motor cycles I meet at stop light tend to compliment the visibility of my tail light.
 

ratz

Wielder of the Rubber Mallet
For those that care.

At this time it looks like there will be less than 50 more DS-500 taillights made. A batch of 20 released yesterday. there are only 7 left. Yes I always recommend stuff that's expensive. But if you want to be seen day or night from behind or the side, this is the last tail light you are likely buy; and this might be that last chance to get them.

We all spend a lot of cash to go fast, some of us (hand raised) stupid fast, I figure it's probably a good idea to spend a fraction of that on stopping (good brakes) and not getting hit (attention drawing lights).... Pluckybond is very excited that she doesn't have share my tailight because I just ordered hers before they faded into the dark for good. I will be more relaxed when I'm at home with the kids and she's out on the open road with cellphone equipped morons.

http://store.designshinelighting.com/Brightest-Taillight-s/1814.htm

This is the tail light used in this video. I have zero affiliation with the product other than as a satisfied customer.

 

super slim

Zen MBB Master
Disappointing but not unexpected exchange with support about the performance curves of the Gemini lights.

Might have been simpler to say; we mass produce our stuff with a low quality standards in china and can't be bothered to test run times because even if we did product variability would make the results useless. So your guess is as good as ours.

*sigh*

Guess I need to figure out a way to do some runtime tests. Leaving the light on is easy figuring out when it turned off not so much; anyone got an old oscilloscope laying around unused?

From: Gemini Lights <support@gemini-lights.com>
Subject: Re: runtimes but Percent level and batter capacity?
Date:
April 18, 2016 at 2:11:28 AM CDT
To: Bob Pankratz <xxxxxxxxxxxx@icloud.com>

Hi Bob,
Thanks for your message.
I’m afraid we don’t have more information other than what is provided on the product page for the Duo. For your reference the Low / Med / High (300, 900, 1500L) settings relate to 20%, 60%, 100% power levels. They are not exactly 10% increments of lumens as this is extremely hard to achieve because there are many variables that affect lumen output. They are merely provided as a guide to the ten power levels available.
DUO 2-CELL
HIGH 1500 1HR 30MINS
MED 900 2HR 10MINS
LOW 300 6HR 30MINS
DUO 4-CELL
HIGH 1500 3HR
MED 900 4HR 20MINS
LOW 300 13HR

--

Chris
Gemini Lights


Website | Facebook


On Apr 14, 2016, at 1:19 PM, Bob Pankratz <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@icloud.com> wrote:

Hello,

We just received our qty 2, Duo Light Sets. I'm looking for more detailed documentation on each Levels Run time based on the size of Battery in mAh. We will be using these for UltraCycling and during training season it is most useful to create a laminated cheat card to document the runs times for each level for each size battery. This allows use to pick the right mode based on the weather, the length of ride and the various battery sizes (and weights) that we have on hand. Also it would be good to know if your 10 levels are truly 10% jump on the spectrum from what Lowest Level Lumens up to the 1500 max.

Ratz,
I checked the battery capacity the long way, by taking volt and amp readings every 15 minutes, to get the VA value, then using an excel spreadsheet checked the battery VA capacity, and the starting and cut out volts of the battery, for each of the light capacities.
I needed a 12" desktop fan to cool the light if above 50% power, but you would not need that!!
 

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super slim

Zen MBB Master
Ratz are you still interested in selling one Designshine DS-1300 headlight, as I rode during night time on Sunday, as winter is setting in "Down Under"!!!

I can not believe how good it is to have 5 steady light settings, and 5 flashing settings where the light intensity is also varied in 3 power levels, so great in the twilight zone!
 

DavidCH

In thought; expanding the paradigm of traversity
For those that care.

At this time it looks like there will be less than 50 more DS-500 taillights made. A batch of 20 released yesterday. there are only 7 left. Yes I always recommend stuff that's expensive. But if you want to be seen day or night from behind or the side, this is the last tail light you are likely buy; and this might be that last chance to get them.

We all spend a lot of cash to go fast, some of us (hand raised) stupid fast, I figure it's probably a good idea to spend a fraction of that on stopping (good brakes) and not getting hit (attention drawing lights).... Pluckybond is very excited that she doesn't have share my tailight because I just ordered hers before they faded into the dark for good. I will be more relaxed when I'm at home with the kids and she's out on the open road with cellphone equipped morons.

http://store.designshinelighting.com/Brightest-Taillight-s/1814.htm

This is the tail light used in this video. I have zero affiliation with the product other than as a satisfied customer.

Love the music in the production "the night stalker". Was it a home brew as Shazam doesn't tell me?
 

ratz

Wielder of the Rubber Mallet
Love the music in the production "the night stalker". Was it a home brew as Shazam doesn't tell me?

Standard trailer music for Apple iMovie. If I recall it was a custom piece composed by Edward White and recorded by the London Symphony Orchestra in 2010. First available in iMovie11.
Works well for a lot of stuff. The chanting is Latin.
 

jond

Zen MBB Master
Now if only B&M would produce battery powered (or ebike versions) of their newest dynamo lights.

sam they have a very good battery light . i use battery and dyno powered B&M ixon iq premium. aa alkaline or nimh rechargeable applicable great light but have not seen the new iq x dynamo only yet in the wild. only suitable though for road.
 

RojoRacing

Donut Powered Wise-guy
Any further review on the Gemini Duo?

I still love the gloworms for the Mtb but I'm considering the Duo on the Vendetta for the 24hr simply for the remote button. I mount the light right at the bottom bracket so I can't reach the wired button on the gloworm. I kind of feel the performance of the gloworm is slightly better but since I only ran it at 20% output last year I figure the Gemini should still be more then enough.
 

ratz

Wielder of the Rubber Mallet
Any further review on the Gemini Duo?

I still love the gloworms for the Mtb but I'm considering the Duo on the Vendetta for the 24hr simply for the remote button. I mount the light right at the bottom bracket so I can't reach the wired button on the gloworm. I kind of feel the performance of the gloworm is slightly better but since I only ran it at 20% output last year I figure the Gemini should still be more then enough.

Ridden with it most of the summer; the daytime flash mode is really good. Nigth time the the remote is the bomb; really like it. I'm getting about 8 hours runtime on flash mode with the 5200mAH battery; the bright level chews through it a lot faster; but the dim level last forever. The defaults have work well enough for our riding that I haven't optimized the levels since we are usually home by 8 hours. There's more to be had tweaking them just haven't had the time.

Is the battery life the best nope; it the brightness sufficient; yep done 40mph in the dark with not worrying about out running the light. But the remote is the deal clincher; any short comings the remote makes up for.

Been using this battery which is pretty much permanently mounted to the boom
http://store.designshinelighting.com/product-p/mj6096.htm
 

RojoRacing

Donut Powered Wise-guy
Good to hear. If I get the Gemini duo I'll just be ordering the light head pack which excludes the battery and charger because I already moved into the next generation of cell capacity two years ago. My 4 cell packs at 6800mah as of two years ago. I'm really surprised we haven't seen the next jump in cell capacity yet, it's long overdue.
 

RojoRacing

Donut Powered Wise-guy
So I was about to pull the trigger on a duo for my 24hr coming up but then I figured I'd drop Jim a line and ask a few questions. Jim has always been extremely strait forward and helpful to me which is why I always make it a point to send people his way when I come to lights. I only wish I getting a monatary discount as well as honest info:)

My questions to Jim
Would you rate the beam performance of the Duo in range of the X2?

Are the run times comparable per brightness?

Can I reprogram the output setting of each of my level while riding as easy as I can with Gloworm?

The honest truth, should I expect as many glitches with wires, boards and general light failures as I seen with gloworm over the last few years?

Any news on gloworm going wireless remote this year? an wireless X1 would be dope for helmets.

Is it possible to go remote switch with the Gemini Xera?

Jim's response

Hi Jason,
I would say the Duo and X2 have similar beams (there optics are interchangeable) and similar output.

Yes it can be simply programed on the fly.

For your question about runtimes, I would figure 50% would about double the runtime of 100%. 20% would be 5 times. There numbers don’t quite agree with that but I question them. I usually find times to be a little better than a straight ratio.

The one place Gloworm has a distinct advantage is in the heat. If you're running on high and it starts getting to hot it will drop to 10 or 20% with no warning. That sounds like it wouldn’t be an issue for you.

Gloworm to start with has more surface area and if it does overheat it drops the power slowly until it stops heating. If you start moving faster and it cools off it then returns to full power.

Gloworm is working on a wireless remote version that should be out in a couple of months. They should make your November time line.

The wiring harness is also getting a big upgrade. (This should solve my past Gloworm wiring issues)

The X1 is likely being discontinued and replaced with a dual XP-G light for the same price or less. It should weigh the same of less too. If I remember right it will have a wireless option. The other will all be wireless stock.

No wireless Xera.
 

ratz

Wielder of the Rubber Mallet
Can I reprogram the output setting of each of my level
I need to figure out how to do that; it's just not something that I have gotten to. I'm not 100% sure you can do it with the wireless remote; so it might require stopping to get to the light if it's mounted down by the feet.
 

RojoRacing

Donut Powered Wise-guy
On the Gloworm it's crazy easy. So you turn it on and while running in any of the modes you just give the button a double tap and the light does a quick double flash before continuing at the previous level and your now in the program mode and still able to ride. So now every singular button press goes up 10% and if you hold the button it starts to step down in 10% increments. Once your at you new desired level you double tap again and your back out of program mode and in normal run mode. You can freely do this with each of the level modes at any time.

Right in the mid of my last 24hr Mtb race I decided it would be better to have my off to on setting go strait to 100% and then step down to 60% and then 20%. So I changed my 20% low setting to 100%, my 60% med stayed the same and my high 100% setting got dropped to 20%. Now when I'm climbing in the dark and start going DH and forget to turn my light back on until the last second I can get my needed 100% for that big rock garden.
 

ratz

Wielder of the Rubber Mallet
On the Gloworm it's crazy easy. So you turn it on and while running in any of the modes you just give the button a double tap and the light does a quick double flash before continuing at the previous level and your now in the program mode and still able to ride. So now every singular button press goes up 10% and if you hold the button it starts to step down in 10% increments. Once your at you new desired level you double tap again and your back out of program mode and in normal run mode. You can freely do this with each of the level modes at any time.

Right in the mid of my last 24hr Mtb race I decided it would be better to have my off to on setting go strait to 100% and then step down to 60% and then 20%. So I changed my 20% low setting to 100%, my 60% med stayed the same and my high 100% setting got dropped to 20%. Now when I'm climbing in the dark and start going DH and forget to turn my light back on until the last second I can get my needed 100% for that big rock garden.

Right now the "flash to pass button" dims the lights; I'm going to have to see if that can be reverse to make it function like a car does; flash for high beam. I've had good luck getting the cars to dim their lights but it could be optimized if that was reversed. Blink mode on a 5200 mha battery is good for about 8 hours; Solid high beam about 2.5 ish. The others I'm not confident enough in my memory to say. Definitely could use a better conservation logic set in the firmware. Low beam is good for most things at night if on a road; and then flash to high beam if there something uncertain. The low beam really looks to last a long time compared to the high beam. As we get into the fall more real world testing in the dark will occur.
 

RojoRacing

Donut Powered Wise-guy
If Jim comes through and gets me a new version Gloworm before I'm force to go duo I'll be sure to come back here with a review. I think I'll probably go with the smallest option that's going to replace the current X1. It'll still be overkill at night on the road and will make a good on the helmet light for MTBing.
 

BJ686

Well-Known Member
Just heard that the Design Shine website added a few more DS 500 lights for sale, so I picked one up (I thought I may have heard they had stopped production, but I guess not). Also picked up a Magic Shine 9096 4 cell battery, which supposedly will run the highest flash for 9 plus hours. Not only did I want something bright, but really like the numerous lighting options on the light for both day and night. I think I saw that Ratz had included a cheat sheet in another post for when to use the numerous options, so I need to track that down.
 

ratz

Wielder of the Rubber Mallet
I think I saw that Ratz had included a cheat sheet in another post for when to use the numerous options, so I need to track that down.

See attached zip file.
 

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trapdoor2

Zen MBB Master
Just heard that the Design Shine website added a few more DS 500 lights for sale, so I picked one up (I thought I may have heard they had stopped production, but I guess not). Also picked up a Magic Shine 9096 4 cell battery, which supposedly will run the highest flash for 9 plus hours. Not only did I want something bright, but really like the numerous lighting options on the light for both day and night. I think I saw that Ratz had included a cheat sheet in another post for when to use the numerous options, so I need to track that down.
I believe DS is stopping production after this last 15 lights. At least, that's what I get from reading their forum postings.
I also have one on order (maybe it can drive over and pick it up...they're less than 10mi from me). Now I need to find a good front light, esp. as the days grow shorter. That Gemini looks pretty sweet. I like having a dimmer switch.
 
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