Silvio 2.0 Build & Maiden Voyage

[Lavs]

Hi all,

I just published two blogs (on my Bengal cat blog) about my Silvio 2.0 build and first ride. My build posting is not very detailed but the the info might be fun and maybe helpful to some.

http://tanj-uschi.blogspot.com/2013/07/new-family-member-cruzbike-silvio-20.html

http://tanj-uschi.blogspot.com/2013/07/cruzbike-maiden-voyage.html

Wooo Hooo,

thanks!

Lavs

 

[Romagjack]

Great pics - you look very

Great pics - you look very comfortable on the bike. Was the seat angle good and how did the headrest feel? Keep us posted.

 

[Lavs]

Thanks, I tried to relax,

Thanks, I tried to relax, which helped, but I was wobbly. The seat angle was good, but I don't have anything to compare it to. It is reclined but comfortable. The headrest seems very good. It hits right at the base of my skull below my helmet. This seems about perfect to me. My head is support and I have good visibility, actually more than on my TT bikes, I'd say, after just one ride.

 

[Eric Winn]

Nice build, good looking

Nice build, good looking bike. You look comfortable and looks like you have a good fit. Good job!

Cool Bengals too, I've always been intrigued by them.

-Eric

 

[Jeremy S]

Thanks for posting this. You

Thanks for posting this. You have a beautiful cat and now a beautiful bike. Who's your photographer?

 

[Lavs]

2nd Hour On My Silvio

I got up early to beat the heat and headed to my closed circuit (empty parking lot) for another hour or learning. I jumped on and was able to relatively easily start pedaling. I cruz-ed around played on cornering etc. You can't speed up the learning curve too much in regards to the total time necessary, but you can increase the frequency of those learning sessions, such that as far as the calendar is concerned the learning curve is sped up.

Notes from my 2^nd hour:
1) The Silvio is certainly nose heavy, relative to even my TT bikes with aero-bars extending out front. The weight is significantly ahead of the front axle. My Silvio likely has a bit more weight out front (than most) because of the chainstay extension (longer lever) and also I have 175mm cranks connected to a triple.

2) To overcome the front weight, it takes a bit of actual steering input from the bars to initiate turns (beyond my wobbling). Some of this could also be because the tire I have on has a good number of miles on it and therefore has a pretty flat section with visibly noticeable shoulders.

3) Cornering is actually very smooth, it does glide around corners well and has good behavior (even in my wobbly state). I need to let it go a bit, when I did, it was smooth and sure footed. In my very early stages of learning to ride this, I feel nervous, but when I let it go around the corners, it tracks nicely.

4) I'm not fit at all right now, but an hour is very comfortable. I'm not pushing hard, and mostly just playing around, getting used to the ride characteristics.

5) When cruz-ing through a sweeping turns, I like the feel of when I rest the inside of my thigh of the outside leg,... this seems to make me feel a bit stabilized/connected to it all.

6) Visibility (sight lines) is/are much better on the Silvio than on my TT bikes,... head is up and looking out.

7) I find cornering a bit easier if I lift my head off the head-rest.

8) 1, 2, & 3 above indicate that the fork rake and headset angle are well designed/planned.

 

[John Tolhurst]

Yes, 
Over time your legs and

Yes,
Over time your legs and arms will combine to initiate turns, and then all sense of heaviness evaporates.

 

[John Tolhurst]

Arm position

Okay Lavs, looking really good and great pictures, thanks!

I've been looking at your body position, could your arms be more straight and more horizontal? Possibilities:

1. rotate bars upwards
2. position brifters to create a more forward grip position on the hoods
3. add a steering tube extender

These suggestions arise when the rider is tall, the shoulders are high, and has the long chainstay extension means the slider isn't heading up so much.

More straight and horizontal arms will translate to

1. better speed
2. better turning control
3. more clearance of bars over legs when maneuvering
4. less arm fatigue

 

[Lavs]

Arm Position

John T,

Yes, I feel my arms are too compressed and low, too. I will likely switch to bull-horns at some point soon (I have some old ones in my "parts"), but right now I'm working with what I have installed. I think more of a superman position (straighter arms) will help me. What I feel mostly with my current arm/hand position and newbee skill set, is my hands grasping the brifters.

Today I did a double. 1 hour in the morning then 1 hour in the evening, all in the parking lots of a local school. Working on my skills. I practiced trying to ride on the painted lines and within the width of marks on the pavement,... working on riding straighter, so I can feel (be confident) that I can stay out of traffic and in the bike lanes when on the road.

I find that I turn 90+ degree corners better if I lift my head off the headrest.

I moved the boom ~1" out (just released the Slider Clamp, ring clamps, and skewer). This kept everything intact, but moved the pedals away an inch (extending my leg reach) and also the bars away (extending my arms). Both will need a bit more adjustment.

Thanks, Lavs

 

[Lavs]

Silvio Tail Loses Control Over Dog

Hi all,

For the first several hours my tail (Silvio 2.0) was more in charge than I was (as far as where we went), but I have taken "command" (mostly) and am feeling much more confident. Starting is not much of an issue. I have rotated my bars and brifters up a bit, this has enabled me to stretch out my arms more and raise my elbows (as per John's recommendation base looking at my position).

As noted above, yesterday (Saturday) I rode 1hr in the morning and 1hr in the afternoon.
I repeated that again today (Sunday), so now I've got 5hrs on my Silvio, in 5 rides over 3 days. All in parking-lots,... I kind of worked-up a course that took me ~4 minutes to get around,... it has 10 speed bumps to shoot the gaps between (forced directional control), several long painted lines to try to ride along, hairpin turns both directions, "fast" sweepers both directions, and 90 degree turns both directions, and it has been windy... so after ~4 hours this dog started to wag the tail instead of the other way around,... i.e. I'm almost ready to head out on the roads. >;-)

Practice, practice, practice. Lavs

 

[ak-tux]

Lavs, congratulations on your

Lavs, congratulations on your new Silvio-2.0. Looking good.

I agree with John Tolhurst, your arms look low and slightly cramped because you are a tall guy. I think you may need to add a Stem Raiser like the one below. About 30$ on ebay. There is a picture of a similar one installed on Vendetta below.

Jim with a Vendetta fitted with a steerer extender.(Take a note of his hands. They are relatively straight and parallel to the graound):

 

[BentBierz]

Hands Level?

Hi ak-tux,

Looking at the Vendetta picture I will agree that the upper arms are parallel but the hands don't appear to be. Are we shooting for straight arms (no elbow bend) and for the whole arm to be parallel to the ground?

 

[ak-tux]

While I'am not the expert

While I'am not the expert here, I think there should be a reasonable elbow bend to allow for turning/steering. However they should not be too bent as to weaken the hand's ability to input power for climbing and acceleration or stabilize the steering for long periods without generating too much fatigue.

I find the phenomena very similar to leg extension for pedaling. If the pedals are too close relative to one's heap when then foot is at the furthest point of the pedal stroke, one cannot generate enough power.

 

[marshall2389]

I have mine set up such that

I have mine set up such that when I want to be aerodynamic I can lean back against my seat, rotate my upper body back, and this straightens my arms making them almost parallel to the ground. In normal riding conditions my upper body (chest, neck, head area) are rotated slightly forward for comfort reasons. This bends my arms slightly allowing for turning control. For tight turns (large steering angles) I sit up a bit so my outside arm can still reach the handlebar.

Things to consider with arm position:

Aerodynamics: parallel and straight is best.
Control: enough elbow bend for handlebar control is needed to still reach the bars when turning. Strongest moment about the steer axis is achieved when you arms are perpendicular to the steer axis (i.e. arms angled upwards). You need this moment to counteract your steer input from pedaling hard.

 

[BentBierz]

marshall2389,
Thanks for the

marshall2389,

Thanks for the info. I'll have to chew on that for a bit as the visuals aren't all immediately jumping out at me.

 

[Lavs]

Updated Hand Position

Hi All,

Thanks for your inputs. I have rotated my bars up to achieve this new position,... It is comfortable and not fatiguing. Insights?

 

[John Tolhurst]

I'm liking it, maybe you

I'm liking it, maybe you don't need the steering extension. Maybe you can roll them down 5 to 10 degs from there, or not. You're looking powerful in that position.

 

[ak-tux]

Power on the hoods and control on the drops!

@Lavs, yeah, that's what I'am talking about! Power on the hoods and control on the drops! Looking good now!

@John Tolhurst, this Silvio 2.0 looks very good indeed! The 27 deg seat angle actually looks very balanced indeed. Not as extreme as some people feared IMHO. Great design!!

 

[John Tolhurst]

@ak-tux, yes, maybe roll the

@ak-tux, yes, maybe roll the hoods forward very very slightly.

 

[Lavs]

Roads Reality Check & Ego Support Request

In the third paragraph I'm going to tell you how I could not make it up a hill on my Silvio today, but first some background.

Today I decided to try my Silvio (and my developing riding "skills") on roads for the first time,... Knowing I wasn't up for dealing with many cars and/or roads with limited shoulders, I drove to a quiet section of my standard 20 mile TT course that I could do an out and back on a few times. My thinking was that this would introduce me to the roads with some cars (minimal at 7+pm), some climbing (1.9mile 5-7% climb), and then higher speeds from the descent back down.

Of note/disclaimer, I've been off the bike for almost two years and I'm ~25+ lbs over my historic "out of shape" beginning of the season weight (I'm 6'4" so its hidden a bit by distribution, at least that is what I've convinced myself of, until I saw the pictures of me on the Silvio!). Also of note, on my DF-TT bikes I historically rode 99% of the time in aero (i.e. always), even on very long and steep climbs,... i.e. I never rode out of the saddle, and rode 90-100rpms most of the time with a functional threshold of ~325N-W,... aannyy-way.

I jumped on my Silvio and started out into a steady ~20mph cross/head wind, my handling was alright, but I felt like I was crawling (no computer/power-meter onboard yet),... I was on my 39T middle chain ring on the flats and rollers,... got to the base of the climb and almost immediately had to drop to my 30T inner ring,... I made it about 300m and was going so slow that I actually had to pull my sneakers (haven't put on my Speed-Plays yet) off the pedals and stop. Erk!!!,... I couldn't start going up-hill, so I turned around and rode back a bit to restart,... this time I gave it all I had and made it about 1000m and could go no further,...

I've climbed this hill hundreds of times and even occasionally in my big chain ring, but always in aero on my DF-TT bikes, I would never, never, never not make it up this hill.

So any way, Thoughts? Insights? Pep-talks? etc. >;-) Besides, get in shape and lose the weight b/c even in this shape I know I could climb that hill in aero on my TT bikes,...

I'm really not that dejected, but truthfully am a fraction concerned about power development (me/reclined position) and transfer (drive-train) on the Silvio.

Thanks for reading, Lavs