bladderhead
Zen MBB Master
Yes. Spin. If you push the crank when it is sticking up you exert leverage on the steering axis. If you push the crank downwards when it is pointing forward you exert no leverage.DocS said:
Vosadrian's V20 Journey - Australia
- Thread starter Bentsoup
- Start date
benphyr
Guru-me-not
I’m told the goal is to get a double chin with the headrest supporting the neck/ skull where they meet just below the helmet without pushing the head or neck up any more than necessary.
Frito Bandito
Zen MBB Master
Yeah, you gotta find that sweet spot. For me, it was pushing the bars all the way in, setting the suspension headrest at the most comfortable position, then bending it forward a little to provide enough head tilt so I can see and no bugs get under my glasses.
benphyr
Guru-me-not
@Frito Bandito How tall are you? In the spine I mean, though height and x-seam would tell the story too.
Frito Bandito
Zen MBB Master
I am 5'10" and my x-seam is 43". My shoulder height is 60"
I have the performance adjustable headrest, but have not used that one yet since the fit is really close now, and getting the bars to seat properly with the Perez clamp appears to have worn it out, so I am worried about damaging it further. It's holding now, but I don't know for how long.
jond
Zen MBB Master
lol ben is the double chin inevitable.
So I put the V20 in my car today. It is an Audi A4 wagon. I could barely get it in!! I often put 2 road bikes complete with both wheels in without issue. The problem is the opening height with the wide bars. I ended up removing the rear wheel to get it as it allowed the wide bars closer to the centre where it is higher. I figured the rear wheel was the easiest thing to take off, but has anyone got recommentation for the easiest things to dissassemble on a V20 to allow it to fit in a car?
Incidentally, this revealled another reason the previous owner of this bike was pretty terrible mechanically with bikes. He had set the brake cables so the calipers were set about right... in the open position! So I had no way to get the tyre out of the caliper without loosening the cable off. Another thing to work on! I was in a rush so I just loosened it and will have to tighten when I put the wheel on for a ride this afternoon. I think I am going to have to rebuild this bike. So far the boom clamp was back to front, the FD shifting was way out, and now the brake callipers!
So off for the first proper ride this afternoon hopefully!
Incidentally, this revealled another reason the previous owner of this bike was pretty terrible mechanically with bikes. He had set the brake cables so the calipers were set about right... in the open position! So I had no way to get the tyre out of the caliper without loosening the cable off. Another thing to work on! I was in a rush so I just loosened it and will have to tighten when I put the wheel on for a ride this afternoon. I think I am going to have to rebuild this bike. So far the boom clamp was back to front, the FD shifting was way out, and now the brake callipers!
So off for the first proper ride this afternoon hopefully!
jond
Zen MBB Master
you got it right rear wheel removal is easy.
pull apart your bike totally after noting your settings. build it up with fresh cables.
in this you will become totally familiar and note any more issues . You will also see how great the quality is of the cruzbike frame which is first class.
good luck
jond
Zen MBB Master
yes there is some designed rise in the rest as it’s pulled outward. Really short people have shortened the vertical rise by cutting and dowel insertion. Maria did this I think from memory. The giro air attack helmet is popular amongst vendetta riders. I have one and also use bontrager ballista. Putting an innertube cut down in a v shape or n or m provides vast improvement. I use a cutdown arm warmer over the oem cover. Just roll up the cut ends of an old 700 c tube cut to size . With a couple small zip ties tie the rolls. You can mess around with glue if you want Pop the valve out down bottom. Inflate mildly and hey presto no blurred vision. Best cheap mod I did. Stays inflated for a week.
Frito Bandito
Zen MBB Master
Like your road bikes, you'll get used to disassembling and assembling it after a few times. The front wheel installation scared the Bejeezus out of me until I watched the video. All of the other stuff is pretty straight forward and simple after having done them numerous times during the fitting phase. It is actually easier than remembering the stack and reach and whatnot on your road bikes because once the head rest, boom and bars are set on the V20 about all you need to do is mark the bars to make setting the bike up easy after transport, if you even need to remove the bars.
Anyway, enjoy the ride braddah!
Anyway, enjoy the ride braddah!
So first proper ride down: https://www.strava.com/activities/5000253215
Everything went OK. I'm certainly no Pro yet though! The path is about 4m wide with 2m for each direction. Normally on a DF I can position myself very accurately, but I certainly found myself wandering all over my side and sometimes onto the other side and having trouble positioning the bike to avoid bumps etc. Though when I was coming up to other traffic I could generally concentrate and get myself within about a 1m target area of the path. I got a couple of unstable wobbles at speed. Generally just stopped pedalling and lifted my head a bit and it stabalised. On some of the slower climbs I was moving around a lot on the path, but did not have to stop at any point. Hopefully with practise I get as controlled as my DF!
I did not feel that it was that easy to go fast. Certainly for the same perceived effort I would have gone 3-5kph faster on my DF. Having said that, my HR was quite low, so I think it may be a case of just not having bent legs... so it feels harder than the power I am putting in. Also, I am sure I lost some speed through technical corners where I was quite nervous on this bike but really carve them up without using any brakes on the DF. I am sure that will improve with time.
But I guess the conclusions I can develop so far are:
* Assuming I can continue to improve, I should be able to get the hang of this thing.
* My back always hurts, but it got no worse on this bike, where on the DF after an hour I just want to get off... which is the main reason for me going this way.
I do have a lot of setup changes to make. I had not got around to fitting the performance adjustable head rest... and I really need that. Head looking too far upwards so I was looking under my glasses and having some visibility problems. Also some boom position changes.
Cheers!
Everything went OK. I'm certainly no Pro yet though! The path is about 4m wide with 2m for each direction. Normally on a DF I can position myself very accurately, but I certainly found myself wandering all over my side and sometimes onto the other side and having trouble positioning the bike to avoid bumps etc. Though when I was coming up to other traffic I could generally concentrate and get myself within about a 1m target area of the path. I got a couple of unstable wobbles at speed. Generally just stopped pedalling and lifted my head a bit and it stabalised. On some of the slower climbs I was moving around a lot on the path, but did not have to stop at any point. Hopefully with practise I get as controlled as my DF!
I did not feel that it was that easy to go fast. Certainly for the same perceived effort I would have gone 3-5kph faster on my DF. Having said that, my HR was quite low, so I think it may be a case of just not having bent legs... so it feels harder than the power I am putting in. Also, I am sure I lost some speed through technical corners where I was quite nervous on this bike but really carve them up without using any brakes on the DF. I am sure that will improve with time.
But I guess the conclusions I can develop so far are:
* Assuming I can continue to improve, I should be able to get the hang of this thing.
* My back always hurts, but it got no worse on this bike, where on the DF after an hour I just want to get off... which is the main reason for me going this way.
I do have a lot of setup changes to make. I had not got around to fitting the performance adjustable head rest... and I really need that. Head looking too far upwards so I was looking under my glasses and having some visibility problems. Also some boom position changes.
Cheers!
jond
Zen MBB Master
post a pic of yourself in profile. Without doubt your neckrest is too far in . Let it out your head should be almost vertical.
jond
Zen MBB Master
we did speak over phone etc but the Voss didn’t need to travel up to paradise
I've spent quite a bit of time in paradise by your definition. I think I still have some KOMs up there! (or close!!) 
Beautiful part of the world!! If I could get a job up there, sign me up!
I ended up coming to the conclusion that a short ride on a Vendetta was probably not going to be helpful... and having now purchased one I think it was the right move. I think that a short ride is probably enough to convince you that they are more difficult than a traditional long chain bent and you really need a few weeks of practise to form an opinion, so a short ride might just scare you off.
Pretty pleased with the decision. I have a long way to go but in the couple weeks I have had 10-15 minutes rides about 5-6 times before a longer ride in a safe place. I feel confident I can work it out and have avoided getting another bent as an intermediate step and have been able to jump straight on the V20 as my first bent. I do think it will be a while to get my bent legs and beat my DF pace. I was a fairly accomplished DF rider and my DF legs were capable of doing 50-100km (not flat at around 1000m elevation per 100km) rides in the 33-38kph range. I think I will get there on the V20... but the hills feel hard at the moment!! They probably always will, but will have to make up for it on the flats.
Beautiful part of the world!! If I could get a job up there, sign me up!I ended up coming to the conclusion that a short ride on a Vendetta was probably not going to be helpful... and having now purchased one I think it was the right move. I think that a short ride is probably enough to convince you that they are more difficult than a traditional long chain bent and you really need a few weeks of practise to form an opinion, so a short ride might just scare you off.
Pretty pleased with the decision. I have a long way to go but in the couple weeks I have had 10-15 minutes rides about 5-6 times before a longer ride in a safe place. I feel confident I can work it out and have avoided getting another bent as an intermediate step and have been able to jump straight on the V20 as my first bent. I do think it will be a while to get my bent legs and beat my DF pace. I was a fairly accomplished DF rider and my DF legs were capable of doing 50-100km (not flat at around 1000m elevation per 100km) rides in the 33-38kph range. I think I will get there on the V20... but the hills feel hard at the moment!! They probably always will, but will have to make up for it on the flats.
Frito Bandito
Zen MBB Master
You probably know of target fixation, and how it can be hazardous to say the least, but it can also be beneficial. I have a few barriers that leave very little margin of error on my usual bike path that are designed so that bicycles can slice through, but mopeds or motorcycles are practically impossible. I have been through them at +50kph (coasting with 1 pedal up and 1 down give a few more cm of leeway) on relatively windless days on my DF bike. On my V20, I unclip before going through them but my most courageous speed has been about 40kph, and that scares the Bejeezus out of me even though the largest part of me and the bike is substantially further away from the narrowest part of the barriers.
How I do it though is focusing, or maybe even target fixation on the very center of the pavement between the edges of the barrier. If I even consider the left or right edge of the barriers it is lights out and time to buy a new bike after I get out of the hospital. No second guessing or trepidation is allowed once I am committed. In the beginning I couldnt see myself going through them with my feet on the pedals but soon I will trust my ability enough to go through them while clipped in.
On my DF bike I am smooth enough to run over individual pebbles if I want to just by leaning. In short spurts I can do that on my V20, but being patient, knowing the limits and being mindful of the wind is vital. Keep at it. It will happen.
I think that is the thing with the DF. I grew up on a BMX from a young age and got pretty good at doing tricks on it. You tend to learn to ride a DF bike with your whole body and not just steering with bars. I often ride with my DF bike in that TT position with elbows on bars and just steering with my body and I could hit a coin on the path at speed while doing it. I also often lift front and rear wheels seperately or hopping the whole bike over obstructions. After having that, it feels quite alien to lose that capability on the bent bike. I am sure there are equivalent body movements you can do that I will learn for subtle steering changes. I need to learn the subtlties of minor steering adjustments when I want them and how to not do them accidentially. I'm not knocking the bent bike... just explaining my feeling of lack of control since I have lost these capabilities initially.
Another thing is the spatial awareness. On a DF bike I know my boundaries well. I can ride within inches of a wall or bollard. The different point of view on the bent has me feeling I am close to touching a wall or fence I am riding beside when in reality I am probably quite far from it. I will develop that over time I am sure. Those stock V20 bars seem very wide to me at the moment!! Not sure if I may change them in future once I have the hang of this.
Another thing is the spatial awareness. On a DF bike I know my boundaries well. I can ride within inches of a wall or bollard. The different point of view on the bent has me feeling I am close to touching a wall or fence I am riding beside when in reality I am probably quite far from it. I will develop that over time I am sure. Those stock V20 bars seem very wide to me at the moment!! Not sure if I may change them in future once I have the hang of this.
