Spring Time - Learning To Ride Time

If you use flat pedals, you might like to try the Pedal Innovations Catalyst. It is a longer pedal that supports a mid foot position. I have used them and it seems to give me more power. The idea that you can spin and use your calf muscles to bring the pedal up is a myth. Research shows that the calf muscle does not fire in the upstroke. It is better to concentrate on the push. This pedal helps to use your glutes and lees of your quads. This contributes to the power of the push. Look at the website, pedaling innovations.com
 

benphyr

Guru-me-not
Spring Time - Take it easy if you have been riding a trainer all winter!

Take it easy on those poor neglected stabilizing muscles, tendons, and ligaments. They haven't been used for months while the already bigger muscles - quads! have been working and are raring to go. Immobile trainer and indoors climate controlled, windless environment all winter vs. your Moving Bottom Bracket (MBB) Cruzbike = easy to hurt something if you don't take it very easy the first ride.

Personal experience: I commute all year round. November-ish switched from QX100 to Rocky Mountain Vertex (hard tail Mountain Bike) with studded tires until about six weeks ago when I transitioned to my Marinoni Tourismo (Road touring bike) as weather and salt conditions changed in preparation for a Cyclo-Cross race that I have always wanted to ride. This winter I also put the Cruzbike conversion kit on the trainer and rode weekly with a friend improving my fitness over winter rather than the opposite. Last night I took out the QX100 for a quick jaunt and noticed a twinge in my knee (quite uncomfortable - don't put any power down kind of feel) within a couple km and returned home on low power. The knee will be fine as this is not completely unheard of for me but I was definitely not pushing it as far as speed, cadence, force are concerned.

Happy Healthy trails to all.
 

paco1961

Zen MBB Master
If you use flat pedals, you might like to try the Pedal Innovations Catalyst. It is a longer pedal that supports a mid foot position. I have used them and it seems to give me more power. The idea that you can spin and use your calf muscles to bring the pedal up is a myth. Research shows that the calf muscle does not fire in the upstroke. It is better to concentrate on the push. This pedal helps to use your glutes and lees of your quads. This contributes to the power of the push. Look at the website, pedaling innovations.com

For flat pedals on a CB I love the Nashbar mtb studded flats. They are cheap, indestructible and reasonably light. The studs give great grip. It’s what I used when I was learning to ride the S40. I know all the experienced cruzbikets out there recommend starting out w clip ins but that was never going to work for me at the outset.
 

benphyr

Guru-me-not
Agreed, everyone should start with flats that have good grip.

Those of us who clip in suggest switching to clipped in as soon as you dare or slightly before as hindsight seems to be a universal "wish I had changed to clipped in sooner".
 

Opik

Well-Known Member
Its not hard. Had a friend who never rode a bent before and was quite handy with the T50 on his first try. This is his 2nd attempt

The trick is... move the bike first. Do this by pushing or going downhill. Learning to pedal from a stop is challenging so learn it later.

I think many fail to learn because they tried to start pedaling from a stop. Just move the bike first using your legs until it has a certain speed that you feel comfortable balancing then start pedalling. You can also run with the bike first then get in
 

Mrnelson

Member
Hey, all, I'm new to the T50, coming to it after 20+ years on various short wheel based rear wheel drive recumbents. This is HARD, just to unlearn everything that's ingrained in me. I've taken a couple of bad falls just trying figure eights. My knees can't take anymore shredding. So my question is, how long can I expect before I'm not taking the occasional dive to the pavement? Obviously not asking for a definite, just want to make sure I don't have too long a road ahead of me, so to speak? Thanks.
 

paco1961

Zen MBB Master
Take it slow and it will come. Do the exercises on the “learning to ride” section of the CB website. I made the jump straight to CB from traditional DF road and mtb. It took me about 5 or 6 sessions in a parking lot before I ventured out onto quiet neighborhood roads. Tooled around the neighborhood roads for a good 6-8 sessions before I ventured out onto other roads around town. But even then I kept speed below 15mph for probably 3 weeks. After that the speed came slowly but steadily. I’m a little over 2 years in now and rarely think about it. Just get on and ride.

Hang in there. The payoff is worth it!
 

Mrnelson

Member
Take it slow and it will come. Do the exercises on the “learning to ride” section of the CB website. I made the jump straight to CB from traditional DF road and mtb. It took me about 5 or 6 sessions in a parking lot before I ventured out onto quiet neighborhood roads. Tooled around the neighborhood roads for a good 6-8 sessions before I ventured out onto other roads around town. But even then I kept speed below 15mph for probably 3 weeks. After that the speed came slowly but steadily. I’m a little over 2 years in now and rarely think about it. Just get on and ride.

Hang in there. The payoff is worth it!

Thanks, that's helpful and encouraging. There's so much to love about the bike, the design, and obviously I love recumbents, it's just a bit hard to learn new tricks and also to be a bit humbled by not being to instantly get it.
Not to mention dumping the bike in front of a bunch of people and having them watch you try to regain control and dignity.
 

Brad R

Well-Known Member
Thanks, that's helpful and encouraging. There's so much to love about the bike, the design, and obviously I love recumbents, it's just a bit hard to learn new tricks and also to be a bit humbled by not being to instantly get it.
Not to mention dumping the bike in front of a bunch of people and having them watch you try to regain control and dignity.

i only had a few years on a Haluzak Horizon before I got the T50. It took me several sessions over several days to get the hang of controlling turns. I did not even attempt any figure 8’s until I mastered going in circles in both directions.

At the start going around in the circle and leaning a little to the outside, my arms would get very tired because I was having to use a lot of arm strength to follow my line around the circle. I could only go around in a circle for a couple minutes at a time before my arms were spent. I knew this had to be wrong. These were 20 to 30 foot diameter circles done at low speed. The thought process that worked for me was to work on finding the body positioning that took the pressure off of my arms as I went around the circle. Then practice finding that position as I started and held the turn. Once I had that going pretty well for counterclockwise, then I worked on clockwise. Only after I was comfortable doing each direction separately did I try going for figure 8’s. Figure 8’s are a good skill, but I thought the change in direction before being comfortable in each direction was too risky for me. I mastered this (or at least got comfortable) in my driveway (30x60 parking area) before venturing out to the high school parking lot. Once I got to the larger area, I practiced transitioning from straight line to turn/curve and back. I was again concentrating on achieving that feeling of making the bike go where I wanted with a light effort from the arms.

I was mostly or entirely coasting through these turns. The removes the steering input from the pedal forces. Again, the key for me was concentrating on finding and feeling the body position (torso leaning to the outside of the turn) that allowed me to swoop through the turn without making my arms fight the bike. This way of thinking and feeling, may not work for everyone, but it worked for me.

I used flat pedals with pins when I was learning. I had decades of experience with SPD cleated pedals. I switched from flats to my cleated shoes after about 50 miles. I immediately felt that I had much better control. If you are comfortable in cleated shoes, then start using them as soon as you are confident that you won’t fall over faster than you can get your foot down as you come to a stop. It helps a lot in letting your feet help steer the bike. You can apply a little sideway force during the power stroke so that your pedaling doesn’t push the wheel from side to side too much.

When I was out riding in the beginning, I would purposely slalom from side to side to develop my feeling of how the bike handles. As time went on, I did that just for fun.

Good luck and enjoy. I just recently went back to rear wheel drive. I had the problem in reverse as I found it difficult to hold the front wheel stable without the help of my legs. And of course, heel interference is nonexistent on the MBB. It took a while to get comfortable and confident that I would launch without turning the wheel and crashing because of heel strike. It took a while to be able to hold a straight line steering with only my hands/arms.
 

chicorider

Zen MBB Master
I went from upright straight to the Vendetta about five years ago, and had no idea what I was doing. My first rides were on arrow-straight, super-lightly traveled roads, where I would occasionally practice gentle swerves left and right--nothing so advanced as figure-8's yet. Having rear-view mirrors helps to keep an eye on traffic. Like Brad said, clipless pedals do help with control, even though the idea of being clipped in seemed scary back then. I eventually graduated to making large turns in an empty parking lot, first one direction, then another. Then figure-8's. The trick for me was to remind myself that there was no rush. If I learned it all in a week, great. If it took a month, or even six months, so be it. Heck, if it took a whole year, but I was noticing improvement along the way, then fine. As it turned out, it took me about a 1000 miles before I didn't have to think much about what I was doing. Now, several years later, it is as natural as riding an upright, and a whole lot more fun and comfortable.

One thing about having a death-grip on the bars: mine was so bad, so tight, that I tore a tendon in my right elbow, sidelining me for seven months while I did a lot of PT. While down I sought advice and got this gem from Robert at Cruzbike: grip the bars as if holding ripe bananas. He was absolutely right. Once I was rolling again, I realized that I had been unnecessarily fighting my legs with my arms rather than smoothing out my pedal stroke and using my arms only as a mild stabilizing input. Now, even when motoring along under full steam, my grip is light and my arms never tire, no matter the distance. The only time my arms really come into play is when sprinting or climbing up a short, steep pitch, similar to getting out of the saddle on an upright.

Enjoy the journey. It's totally worth it.
 

Mrnelson

Member
I went from upright straight to the Vendetta about five years ago, and had no idea what I was doing. My first rides were on arrow-straight, super-lightly traveled roads, where I would occasionally practice gentle swerves left and right--nothing so advanced as figure-8's yet. Having rear-view mirrors helps to keep an eye on traffic. Like Brad said, clipless pedals do help with control, even though the idea of being clipped in seemed scary back then. I eventually graduated to making large turns in an empty parking lot, first one direction, then another. Then figure-8's. The trick for me was to remind myself that there was no rush. If I learned it all in a week, great. If it took a month, or even six months, so be it. Heck, if it took a whole year, but I was noticing improvement along the way, then fine. As it turned out, it took me about a 1000 miles before I didn't have to think much about what I was doing. Now, several years later, it is as natural as riding an upright, and a whole lot more fun and comfortable.

One thing about having a death-grip on the bars: mine was so bad, so tight, that I tore a tendon in my right elbow, sidelining me for seven months while I did a lot of PT. While down I sought advice and got this gem from Robert at Cruzbike: grip the bars as if holding ripe bananas. He was absolutely right. Once I was rolling again, I realized that I had been unnecessarily fighting my legs with my arms rather than smoothing out my pedal stroke and using my arms only as a mild stabilizing input. Now, even when motoring along under full steam, my grip is light and my arms never tire, no matter the distance. The only time my arms really come into play is when sprinting or climbing up a short, steep pitch, similar to getting out of the saddle on an upright.

Enjoy the journey. It's totally worth it.
Thanks, very helpful. I worked on turns today and then did a longer ride (it's only day four, so I'm giving myself a break) and I have to say it was probably a breakthrough day, i.e., I really started enjoying it and wasn't focused at all on "not falling over".
Though I did get a momentary tremble and near-fall next to steep embankment above a lake. That would have have been a story to share.
 

benphyr

Guru-me-not
. ...
Though I did get a momentary tremble and near-fall next to steep embankment above a lake. That would have have been a story to share.
. I can see the headlines already ...
“News flash:
During skills lesson Cruzbike escapes and
gives new handler triathlon lesson:
flying, swimming, and walking home.”
 

Mrnelson

Member
. I can see the headlines already ...
“News flash:
During skills lesson Cruzbike escapes and
gives new handler triathlon lesson:
flying, swimming, and walking home.”
Haha, yes, I had it all in my mind in that split second.

But a good ride today, getting better pretty quickly (hope I don't regret the boast), thanks for your help.
 

deadbeatdon

Member
Finally! I’ve been lurking here occasionally and dreaming for years and my used y frame conversion arrived today. Went for a couple very short, very awkward, very exhausting And very fun rides today. Primary focus tomorrow will be open palms and figure 8s.
Cheers!
 

benphyr

Guru-me-not
Remember to start slow with the easiest drills. Figure eights might not be considered easy depending. But that is of course your call based on how things progress. There can be some reprogramming of the cranial computer required... hopefully yours is more flexible than mine the first couple outings. But that was years ago and I’ve been riding no hands and cruzbiking as my go to ride for all but snow.
 

deadbeatdon

Member
There can be some reprogramming of the cranial computer required... hopefully yours is more flexible than mine the first couple outings. But that was years ago and I’ve been riding no hands and cruzbiking as my go to ride for all but snow.
The reprogramming is happening but I had a bit of a head start. I was able to hold off on the Cruzbike for so long because I picked up a brute of a cargo trike a few years ago. It is FWD but the bb and the seat swivelled together and the handle bars are rigid with the frame. I was very used to leaning into corners and today I was able to break out of that. It’s great to have a turning radius way tighter than a couple of lanes. Sadly the trike ran off with someone else a few weeks ago. I’m really going to miss it when the snow flies!
D5F480A2-F1F0-499D-8EA8-DF50378FAFA7.jpeg
 

deadbeatdon

Member
no chance of that beast tipping in the corners.
The Delta design is surprisingly tippy and I took a few spills cornering at speed. It was much better with a load though. I really fell in love with riding an 80lb mule that begged me to pile on another 500. That picture is from a week when I covered 500km and the yellow bag is the tripod for my telescope. I ended up only setting it up once but never regretted having it along. Well, the tears are starting to well up so it’s time to Cruz ‘round a bit. ♾
 
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