gaspi101
Well-Known Member
I need to put all my audax brevet cards away…TIL I’m a “non-cyclist.” Never heard of this…lol but I guess, to each their own!
To V20c as a lifelong DF roadie
- Thread starter gaspi101
- Start date
TransAm
Well-Known Member
I developed a pinched nerve in my neck and instantly went from being able to bang out a century before lunch to being unable to ride to the end of the driveway (my profile pic is on a 24h TT at Sebring FL). It was all I could do to walk around the block due to neuropathy pain. I needed PT a few times a week just to function. The PT basically came down to tucking in my chin and core strength.
I needed to avoid tilting my head back, as on an upright bike, because the pinch point was in the back of my neck. I had figured I would end up on a recumbent after I turned 60, and expected it would be a Schlitter Encore stick bike. But I decided to get a Cruzbike for the core engagement. And like you, I didn't want to mess around, so I just got the V20. Once I started riding it, I was able to quit PT, and have not looked back.
I definitely agree. It's more difficult to turn head back to see what's behind with a recumbent bike. I have two rear view mirrors. Garmin Varia radar is also a must, at least for me. I have other accessories- flashing front light as well as front and rear cameras. Might be a little excessive but just for a peace of mind.
JOSEPHWEISSERT
Zen MBB Master
What cameras do you use?I definitely agree. It's more difficult to turn head back to see what's behind with a recumbent bike. I have two rear view mirrors. Garmin Varia radar is also a must, at least for me. I have other accessories- flashing front light as well as front and rear cameras. Might be a little excessive but just for a peace of mind.
Frito Bandito
Zen MBB Master
I have a bell on one side of the bars to let people know I'm passing and a mirror on the other side to watch them disappear. I need to get a louder bell though so they can get an earlier advanced warning because the V20 is just that fast
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Frito Bandito
Zen MBB Master
I've never worn one but then again I have never been in a race with a fast group in which setting a 4, 6, 12 or even a 24 hour record is the goal, and stopping for a pee break means being left behind and then having to burn several matches trying to get back in the lead group was required. You can either pull a "That's pretty warm" Dumb And Dumber heading over the mountain pass re-creation, and bear it until you can hose off after the ride is finished, or choose the lesser of 2 evils option and keep your matches to use when they might result in a better finish.
gaspi101
Well-Known Member
no no, i get it…I get the extreme measures when you’re trying to set a record, and every second (apparently) counts. but thats not what the guy said…he said he wears a condom catheter EVERY TIME he rides. Mind blown. And here I am trying to think of ways to ride in a group lol
gaspi101
Well-Known Member
This is promising stuff…I hate doing PT, hope i can track your path….does it really engage the core?
I use Cycliq Fly6 for the back. Front one just a knock-off Go Pro connected to a small portable charger.
Hi @gaspi101,
Sorry I am a little late to this thread as I have been a bit busy to catchup on here lately. I thought I would chime in as you seem in a similar situation to me about 18 months ago. I have ridden road bikes regularly since my early 30s and I am 49 now. I have done club level racing up to cat 1, and plenty of riding in fast bunches. My lower back got to the point that I was not enjoying my road bike anymore as I could only ride for about an hour before the pain became unbearable. So I found myself in a similar situation to you about 18 months ago. I test rode a few RWD recumbents (performance oriented so fairly reclined), and picked them up quickly like you. I liked the idea of a V20 as it used the same components as my road bikes so I could run my wheels/groupset etc. on it. I bit the bullet and got one taking the risk of whether it would work for me.
Maybe I was lucky, but I picked it up pretty quick. I was riding my normal bike path (avoiding busy roads) within a couple weeks, and my normal roads within a month or so. My good road bike is a Specialized Venge which is a pretty fast road bike, so I had a bit of a need for speed, and also good wheels and groupset. Needless to say, my V20 now runs Ultegra DI2 11X2 groupset, some narrow road bars, a set of 90mm deep fast wheels with tubeless tyres etc.
These days I ride both my DF and the V20. I have found that the V20 is great on the fast roads, but not so great on the hills around me (I live in Sydney and most of rides have 1000m elevation per 100km, so itS fairly hilly where I live). By using my DF only on the hilly rides, I am not bent over in the drops as much, and also less frequently on the DF bike, so my back is coping a bit better on the DF. The V20 rides I do also have some hills to get to the flat roads, but then are mainly rolling hills/flat, and it is fast!! I can cruise at 40kph (25mph) at about 180W which I can do for hours. Here is a ride I just did in my lunch break on it: https://www.strava.com/activities/7794172449 . The middle bit is pretty quick, but I have hills to get to/from my house.
Here are my observations of the V20 from a serious road bike rider:
* It is very fast on flat roads... anywhere you were going >30kph on a road bike, you will be going 5-10kph faster on the V20.
* It is also very fast on rolling hills where you are not climbing for longer than a minute. Longer steeper climbs are harder and slower than DF.
* Really steep climbs are tough (>10%). It is much less stable than DF and wheel slip is an issue. I can't stay in the full reclined position and it is just hard! On the DF steep stuff is hard but much more managable. There are some riding loops near me I won't do on the V20 as the have >15%.
* Medium steep climbs are OK for stability, but they are tough just because you can't stand up and move around to mix up the muscle use.
* Less steep climbs are OK, and probably as quick as the DF up to about 3% for me.
* The v20 is very fast through a corner, but you have to commit to it early, and difficult to adjust mid corner. This makes me back off more than DF on blind corners as I cannot see a car coming. On the DF I can adjust my line if I need to.
* Clipping in and getting going is not as easy as DF. Fairly easy on flat roads. Worse on hills. I find I have to pull myself forward to get going, and it gets tiring doing this with lots of traffic lights. I tend to try to do my V20 rides on roads without much interruption. On the DF I don;t even think about clipping in and don't need to pull my body forward to get going.
* The V20 is very compatible with road bike stuff. I have used all my road bike stuff on my V20... from wheels/groupset, shoes, power meters, cycling kit, helmets. I think the V20 is probably the Bent that is closest to road bike. Bib knicks work fine. The padding does nothing, but causes no issue for me. I where the same everything and can get dressed and go out to my garage and select which bike I will use.
* I don't intentionally ride my V20 with other DF riders. Sometimes I get into a dice with one because we met out on the road. Where I live is hilly, and in a bunch I would be fast on the down hills and slow on the up hills. If it was flatter, I would consider it, but I know my mates will cruise on the down hill and then hit it up the hill to drop me, and then they will roll turns at 25-30mph to make sure I don't get back!! I ride the DF for my bunch rides. Local bunchs near me can easily do 45+kph if motivated to do so.
* The V20 is very easy on my back... I can ride for hours and have done up to 200km on it. But long endurance rides is not my thing. I prefer 1-2 hour big efforts.
* Training routines are the same as what I have always done on the DF... the body works the same!!
* I am about 15% down on power on the V20 compared to my DF. I think it is a combo of just not have as much strength in the reclined position, and the fact I cannot adjust my muscle usage by moving around like I do on the DF. This is the one of the reasons I am slower climbing, but the aero efficiency more than makes up for the power loss when going fast.
I think you are heading in the right direction with the V20C. It is similar to my V20. I expect you will have a similar experience to myself.
Cheers!
Sorry I am a little late to this thread as I have been a bit busy to catchup on here lately. I thought I would chime in as you seem in a similar situation to me about 18 months ago. I have ridden road bikes regularly since my early 30s and I am 49 now. I have done club level racing up to cat 1, and plenty of riding in fast bunches. My lower back got to the point that I was not enjoying my road bike anymore as I could only ride for about an hour before the pain became unbearable. So I found myself in a similar situation to you about 18 months ago. I test rode a few RWD recumbents (performance oriented so fairly reclined), and picked them up quickly like you. I liked the idea of a V20 as it used the same components as my road bikes so I could run my wheels/groupset etc. on it. I bit the bullet and got one taking the risk of whether it would work for me.
Maybe I was lucky, but I picked it up pretty quick. I was riding my normal bike path (avoiding busy roads) within a couple weeks, and my normal roads within a month or so. My good road bike is a Specialized Venge which is a pretty fast road bike, so I had a bit of a need for speed, and also good wheels and groupset. Needless to say, my V20 now runs Ultegra DI2 11X2 groupset, some narrow road bars, a set of 90mm deep fast wheels with tubeless tyres etc.
These days I ride both my DF and the V20. I have found that the V20 is great on the fast roads, but not so great on the hills around me (I live in Sydney and most of rides have 1000m elevation per 100km, so itS fairly hilly where I live). By using my DF only on the hilly rides, I am not bent over in the drops as much, and also less frequently on the DF bike, so my back is coping a bit better on the DF. The V20 rides I do also have some hills to get to the flat roads, but then are mainly rolling hills/flat, and it is fast!! I can cruise at 40kph (25mph) at about 180W which I can do for hours. Here is a ride I just did in my lunch break on it: https://www.strava.com/activities/7794172449 . The middle bit is pretty quick, but I have hills to get to/from my house.
Here are my observations of the V20 from a serious road bike rider:
* It is very fast on flat roads... anywhere you were going >30kph on a road bike, you will be going 5-10kph faster on the V20.
* It is also very fast on rolling hills where you are not climbing for longer than a minute. Longer steeper climbs are harder and slower than DF.
* Really steep climbs are tough (>10%). It is much less stable than DF and wheel slip is an issue. I can't stay in the full reclined position and it is just hard! On the DF steep stuff is hard but much more managable. There are some riding loops near me I won't do on the V20 as the have >15%.
* Medium steep climbs are OK for stability, but they are tough just because you can't stand up and move around to mix up the muscle use.
* Less steep climbs are OK, and probably as quick as the DF up to about 3% for me.
* The v20 is very fast through a corner, but you have to commit to it early, and difficult to adjust mid corner. This makes me back off more than DF on blind corners as I cannot see a car coming. On the DF I can adjust my line if I need to.
* Clipping in and getting going is not as easy as DF. Fairly easy on flat roads. Worse on hills. I find I have to pull myself forward to get going, and it gets tiring doing this with lots of traffic lights. I tend to try to do my V20 rides on roads without much interruption. On the DF I don;t even think about clipping in and don't need to pull my body forward to get going.
* The V20 is very compatible with road bike stuff. I have used all my road bike stuff on my V20... from wheels/groupset, shoes, power meters, cycling kit, helmets. I think the V20 is probably the Bent that is closest to road bike. Bib knicks work fine. The padding does nothing, but causes no issue for me. I where the same everything and can get dressed and go out to my garage and select which bike I will use.
* I don't intentionally ride my V20 with other DF riders. Sometimes I get into a dice with one because we met out on the road. Where I live is hilly, and in a bunch I would be fast on the down hills and slow on the up hills. If it was flatter, I would consider it, but I know my mates will cruise on the down hill and then hit it up the hill to drop me, and then they will roll turns at 25-30mph to make sure I don't get back!! I ride the DF for my bunch rides. Local bunchs near me can easily do 45+kph if motivated to do so.
* The V20 is very easy on my back... I can ride for hours and have done up to 200km on it. But long endurance rides is not my thing. I prefer 1-2 hour big efforts.
* Training routines are the same as what I have always done on the DF... the body works the same!!
* I am about 15% down on power on the V20 compared to my DF. I think it is a combo of just not have as much strength in the reclined position, and the fact I cannot adjust my muscle usage by moving around like I do on the DF. This is the one of the reasons I am slower climbing, but the aero efficiency more than makes up for the power loss when going fast.
I think you are heading in the right direction with the V20C. It is similar to my V20. I expect you will have a similar experience to myself.
Cheers!
Mathew Fy
GRU
I use Cycliq cameras front & rear.
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JOSEPHWEISSERT
Zen MBB Master
It’s not really an extreme measure any more than wearing a helmet on your head is extreme or riding 100 miles is extreme or using mirrors and lights is extreme or wearing spandex is extreme. It’s all perspective. The benefits of not having to stop and not trying to find a place to safely pee in public multiple times on a training ride lasting 5 hours or longer justify the two seconds it takes to put on a catheter when getting dressed.
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gaspi101
Well-Known Member
I appreciate the point of view and no judgments here. But I’m afraid on this we differ.
I’ve hit potholes before, where my water bottle went flying out. What happens to that bag of urine you carry in similar circumstances? Isn’t it a….hazard?
JOSEPHWEISSERT
Zen MBB Master
There is a bit of confusion here. There is no bag of urine. That would be gross. The urine gets redirected to the side of the road by way of the extension tube. Then the tube gets tucked back under the jersey. No big deal.
gaspi101
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the great write up vosadrian. I agree, it seems I am on a very similar path as you were, at least I hope so! I never did race road bikes, although Cat 2 racers in my groups were not uncommon. I think Cat 1 are probably too fast for my abilities, this being more of a weekend sport for me, as I work long hours during the weekdays.
Like you, I have a feeling I will pick it up quickly as well, and I’m rather anxious to do so. I live in Miami, which is flat as a pancake. We have one bridge that is 4% for about a quarter mile that’s it (actually, the 4% section is even shorter), so that shouldn’t be an issue. What we have a lot of is wind. Riding along the coast or in the Everglades where there is nothing taller than a blade of grass for miles in any direction means we contend with strong 15-20mph wind all the time. It seems like a place where a recumbent would thrive. I had no idea Sydney was so hilly! Must be nice to have that level of variety. I’m glad you still get to ride your DF from time to time, I hope that is also in my future, although I’m told that may not be the case.
Your Strava ride is impressive! 24mph average over 40 miles while only spending 180w average tells the whole tale. Looking through my Garmin and Strava, if I should average 180w, I would probably average 18-19mph, not much more. Then again, I’m no Cat1 racer! Impressive numbers, thanks for sending! I’m looking forward to seeing what I can do on a Vendetta…I am glad to see from your figures that you do seem to get a good workout. Zone 3 Hr average is great, I was concerned if not be able to get out Zone 2 while riding normally.
What do you use for bike shoes? I’m told some normal road shoes (SPD SL), and other use a mod-cleat position shoe (often hand-modified) with mountain pedals. Given the different body position, what do you find is the most comfortable and efficient? Also, given the greater need to put a foot down when first learning or when avoiding a crash (given the more limited maneuverability), would it make sense to use a mountain/SPD cleat and shoe?
gaspi101
Well-Known Member
I see, and I imagine you pull over to a grassy area or something, do your business and then keep going? Or do you let it go while riding?
JOSEPHWEISSERT
Zen MBB Master
It means urinating discreetly while riding. You don’t even have to slow down.
TransAm
Well-Known Member
Yes, you can pull on the CB handlebars, like on an upright bike. Stick bikes have big stack heights and long handlebars to get around your bent legs, so you can't really pull on them to engage the core.
