Tubeless tires anyone?

RojoRacing

RojoRacing

Donut Powered Wise-guy
Saw a ride running tubeless have his tire blow off the rim rolling at 10 mph only 1/4 mile into our double century yesterday. The tire was several rides old and the only change from normal is the ride going from 80 psi to 100 psi for the smoother roads on the course for that day. If that had happened in a corner or at high speed would would have had zero chance of not crashing because I could hear his bare carbon rim rolling on the asphalt as he slowed to a complete stop. His was on proper tubeless tires on what looked like generic carbon tubeless rims so it's scary to see it happen on a setup claiming to handle that exact use.
 
jond

jond

Zen MBB Master
I DONT BELIEVE IT. Mr Mel drew

Yep last night I caught a wash out felt like rear but was actually front. Lucky lucky lucky to stay upright.

Slow leak wire still hanging on outside brand new tyre!!. 20 klm in on a right angle 90 deg turn .Lucky didn’t edge rim. New wheels yoleo.
So would have been more painful than gravel rash. I walked home unable to inflate new tube for goodness sake new pump is no more. Opened garage took out hurricane for little ride.
Felt better then. Fixed flat this morning in anticipation of tonight’s slower ride no doubt.
Confidence shattering with air escape. Lol

Bah last time I talk about flats!!! Two flats to come no doubt in quick succession lol.

You know tubeless or tubes. We are nuts trusting tyres so fragile at 80 -90 klm / hr downhill.

Been riding 406 schwalbe marathons on the hurricane and I feel pretty confident compared to Schwalbe Pro ones or Conti gp 4000s or gators or four seasons.

Swings and roundabouts maybe it’s tannus after all lol. Sick wash my mouth out.
 
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Osiris

Osiris

Zen MBB Master
RojoRacing said:
Saw a ride running tubeless have his tire blow off the rim rolling at 10 mph only 1/4 mile into our double century yesterday. The tire was several rides old and the only change from normal is the ride going from 80 psi to 100 psi for the smoother roads on the course for that day. If that had happened in a corner or at high speed would would have had zero chance of not crashing because I could hear his bare carbon rim rolling on the asphalt as he slowed to a complete stop. His was on proper tubeless tires on what looked like generic carbon tubeless rims so it's scary to see it happen on a setup claiming to handle that exact use.
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Hmmm. I'm seriously considering going back to regular tires now. :eek:
 
RojoRacing

RojoRacing

Donut Powered Wise-guy
Osiris said:
Hmmm. I'm seriously considering going back to regular tires now. :eek:
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Right but then again I've seen the same thing happen in the parking lot before the start of a ride back before tubeless. If a tire can be stretched and pushed off the lip of a rim at 100 psi while tubeless then the same can be done via a tube as well, it shouldn't matter what's doing the pushing from within. You should be considering going back to rims with bead hooks.
 
Osiris

Osiris

Zen MBB Master
RojoRacing said:
Right but then again I've seen the same thing happen in the parking lot before the start of a ride back before tubeless. If a tire can be stretched and pushed off the lip of a rim at 100 psi while tubeless then the same can be done via a tube as well, it shouldn't matter what's doing the pushing from within. You should be considering going back to rims with bead hooks.
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Oh, OK. I thought you were saying that the separation problem was specific to tubeless rims. One thing that is different, it seems to me, is that a tubeless tire will deflate the moment a gap opens up between the tire and the rim, which would not be the case with a regular tire and inner tube.
 
RojoRacing

RojoRacing

Donut Powered Wise-guy
Osiris said:
Oh, OK. I thought you were saying that the separation problem was specific to tubeless rims. One thing that is different, it seems to me, is that a tubeless tire will deflate the moment a gap opens up between the tire and the rim, which would not be the case with a regular tire and inner tube.
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The moment a gap open between the tire and rim when running a inner tube at 100psi that tube will force it's way out and explode instantly. You will not see the tube bulging out from the side like with a tiny tear, it'll just explode.

I think the riders problem was related to his rims and tire combo because with my enve rims the bead locks on so damn tight that once seated at pressure that first time it's hell and a half to break that bead at zero psi. It's like breaking the bead on my motorcycle tires except I can't use steel tools on a carbon rim.
 
DavidCH

DavidCH

In thought; expanding the paradigm of traversity
If you pump up your tubeless tires straight to 100psi you are asking for trouble. Bed it in at 80psi , 90psi . I don't usually do 100 psi. But 95psi is just fine.
Perhaps I should carry an inner tube... but I don't. If I carry an inner tube I am asking for a puncture.
 
Osiris

Osiris

Zen MBB Master
RojoRacing said:
The moment a gap open between the tire and rim when running a inner tube at 100psi that tube will force it's way out and explode instantly. You will not see the tube bulging out from the side like with a tiny tear, it'll just explode.
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At full pressure, yes. I was thinking of cases where the tire has already lost considerable pressure due to a puncture(s) or a leaky valve stem.

I think the riders problem was related to his rims and tire combo because with my enve rims the bead locks on so damn tight that once seated at pressure that first time it's hell and a half to break that bead at zero psi. It's like breaking the bead on my motorcycle tires except I can't use steel tools on a carbon rim.
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That's what bothers me about my tubeless wheels. I always carry a couple of inner tubes in case I should suffer a flat that won't seal, but getting the tubeless tire off to insert the tube is a nightmare. I almost broke the tire lever doing it.
 
T

tiltmaniac

Zen MBB Master
Osiris said:
At full pressure, yes. I was thinking of cases where the tire has already lost considerable pressure due to a puncture(s) or a leaky valve stem.



That's what bothers me about my tubeless wheels. I always carry a couple of inner tubes in case I should suffer a flat that won't seal, but getting the tubeless tire off to insert the tube is a nightmare. I almost broke the tire lever doing it.
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I like the Pedro (plastic) tire levers for that job. I've broken a few 'steel core' tire levers but never the Pedro's.
 
RojoRacing

RojoRacing

Donut Powered Wise-guy
Getting the tires on or off my enve rims is no harder then any of my other wheel setups, it breaking the bead once it been seated that is a whole other experience. If you ever feared your tire coming off at lower pressures then enve rims are the way to go.
 
Osiris

Osiris

Zen MBB Master
RojoRacing said:
Getting the tires on or off my enve rims is no harder then any of my other wheel setups, it breaking the bead once it been seated that is a whole other experience. If you ever feared your tire coming off at lower pressures then enve rims are the way to go.
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I noticed that there are significant differences among wheels when it comes to the ease of removing and mounting tires. With my Zipp wheels, I don't even need to use a tire lever. Does this mean that they have a higher potential for coming off the rim during a ride?
 
T

tiltmaniac

Zen MBB Master
Osiris said:
I noticed that there are significant differences among wheels when it comes to the ease of removing and mounting tires. With my Zipp wheels, I don't even need to use a tire lever. Does this mean that they have a higher potential for coming off the rim during a ride?
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Probably. More interestingly, it probably also means (even) less control if/when tire pressure is lost.
But always, "it depends". I also don't see anyone actually testing this in a controlled way, so it is just anecdotal evidence until someone actually decides to do a study...
 
E

ed72

Zen MBB Master
Continental's GP4000sii replacement (GP5000) will be offered in a tubeless version. The tubed version is claimed to have 12% lower rolling resistance and the tubeless 17% less than the GP4000sii. Better puncture resistance is claimed as well. And they will be offered in 32 mm. The tubed version is currently available if one looks but I have not seen the tubeless, yet. They sound like a huge step up in what was arguably the best all around tire ever made.

https://www.continental-tires.com/bicycle/tires/race-tires
 
Balor

Balor

Zen MBB Master
"Embedded in the tire construction the Active Comfort Technology absorbs vibrations and smoothens your ride"
What the hell is THAT?
 
E

ed72

Zen MBB Master
Balor said:
"Embedded in the tire construction the Active Comfort Technology absorbs vibrations and smoothens your ride"
What the hell is THAT?
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I read that too. I had no idea. It actually sounds counter productive, no? Absorb implies energy loss, right?
 
E

ed72

Zen MBB Master
One can only hope all five molds are equivalent instead of the one magic, super aero GP4000 one. They are laser etched pattern in the tire that creates turbulence for better performance on wider yaw angles. The TL version is heavy. I don't get the stiff sidewall of the so-called Active Comfort Technology. Maybe just fancy marketing to overcome the complaints of sidewall ruptures/cuts on the old tire? One thing is for sure, Conti is late to the game if you're going to be late, you better be great. I also read 20% longer life as if the old tire didn't last long enough.
 
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