Zwift - Cruzbike Activities (races and group rides)
- Thread starter RojoRacing
- Start date
LarryOz
Cruzeum Curator & Sigma Wrangler
Yeah - most people use some kind of cheat to get the KOM - either putting their weight super low or "other" methods.
I remember looking at one segment and saw the average wkg that the KOM holder had used. I just about killed myself to match those figures, only to find myself way down the list. haha
That is the one and only time I ever even looked at KOM on Zwift until today. Would not have even looked today had I received the automatic email that someone stole the KOM from me. Oh well.
It is still a nice training medium. I still write and ride my own workouts about 95% of the time and just use the VR part to keep me distracted.
RojoRacing
Donut Powered Wise-guy
Did my first zwift race in what feels like a year and thank god I was the only A rider because damn am I not A racer quality right now. I mean I was only really ever premium cannon fodder in the A cat when I was fast but now I'm honestly a solid B rider right now 
. I had a few B riders in tow so I played a little game of drop the others on the 8% innsbruck climb which opened a 12 second gap. They fought hard to inch it back over the next full lap and since I was already tired after only 7 miles I let them catch me just before the climb on the second lap. With them on the edge from closing the gap I attacked even harder and opened a 30 second gap and continued to add a few seconds each mile after for most the rest of the race. Each lap I was maintaining threshold HR of a little over 170bpm so made sure with a half mile before each laps climb I dropped it down to 165 before attacking the climb. I knew my HR would raise 15bpm over the 1 min climb so by starting at 165 I could keep it from going any higher than 180 which is a no no for me unless it's the final sprint.
I was amazed at how weak I felt never really able to hold over 4.0 W/KG for any length of time which is the minimum for A racer qualification. By the time I hit the last lap I had nearly a 2min lead so with no one to fight over the win with I eased it home and took the sprint jersey on the last lap as a consolation prize.
As an added bonus at around the halfway point I noticed Ken Holzhausen in the racers list with Cruzbike after his name. What are the chances I'd see a cruzebike racer in some random zwift race after nearly a year off? Ken I would have replied to you in game comment on the last lap but I don't have my mini keyboard setup.
. I had a few B riders in tow so I played a little game of drop the others on the 8% innsbruck climb which opened a 12 second gap. They fought hard to inch it back over the next full lap and since I was already tired after only 7 miles I let them catch me just before the climb on the second lap. With them on the edge from closing the gap I attacked even harder and opened a 30 second gap and continued to add a few seconds each mile after for most the rest of the race. Each lap I was maintaining threshold HR of a little over 170bpm so made sure with a half mile before each laps climb I dropped it down to 165 before attacking the climb. I knew my HR would raise 15bpm over the 1 min climb so by starting at 165 I could keep it from going any higher than 180 which is a no no for me unless it's the final sprint. I was amazed at how weak I felt never really able to hold over 4.0 W/KG for any length of time which is the minimum for A racer qualification. By the time I hit the last lap I had nearly a 2min lead so with no one to fight over the win with I eased it home and took the sprint jersey on the last lap as a consolation prize.
As an added bonus at around the halfway point I noticed Ken Holzhausen in the racers list with Cruzbike after his name. What are the chances I'd see a cruzebike racer in some random zwift race after nearly a year off? Ken I would have replied to you in game comment on the last lap but I don't have my mini keyboard setup.
CruzLike
Guru
Welcome back Jason
I was pleasantly surprised at the Ride on you gave me. I then put on my glasses and saw that you were riding the same race as myself. I'm not the most attentive zwifter without specs.
I'm sure there are different stroke for different folks, I like the InnsbruckRing. It provides me with areas of effort and rest and heightened areas of effort with rest.
I usually ride 4 laps and call it an hour. This was the first time I have ridden 7 laps at speed. The attendance was a little lower than I like, as Jason commented. I was dropped by the other 3 C riders after 3 miles. I rode the rest alone.
Highlights of the ride, I did not fall off the cliff after 4 laps. Energy stayed higher an expected and finished the last lap a little faster than the 6th. Jason may not have known this, I was keeping an eye on his distance behind me. I was hoping he would not pass me in the 38 mile race. For last 3 laps the gap seemed to level off and saved the humiliation of being lapped. Maybe another time Jason.
I paced myself pretty good climbing "the hill". I climbed each hill at around 310w without popping. This may be an area of improvement though. Whenever I climb that hill with a group, no one can stay with me. Everyone seems to pull away from me and I spend the downhill and then some catching up.
Congrats Jason. Get your legs back, fall is coming and riders will return to Z.
I was pleasantly surprised at the Ride on you gave me. I then put on my glasses and saw that you were riding the same race as myself. I'm not the most attentive zwifter without specs.
I'm sure there are different stroke for different folks, I like the InnsbruckRing. It provides me with areas of effort and rest and heightened areas of effort with rest.
I usually ride 4 laps and call it an hour. This was the first time I have ridden 7 laps at speed. The attendance was a little lower than I like, as Jason commented. I was dropped by the other 3 C riders after 3 miles. I rode the rest alone.
Highlights of the ride, I did not fall off the cliff after 4 laps. Energy stayed higher an expected and finished the last lap a little faster than the 6th. Jason may not have known this, I was keeping an eye on his distance behind me. I was hoping he would not pass me in the 38 mile race. For last 3 laps the gap seemed to level off and saved the humiliation of being lapped. Maybe another time Jason.
I paced myself pretty good climbing "the hill". I climbed each hill at around 310w without popping. This may be an area of improvement though. Whenever I climb that hill with a group, no one can stay with me. Everyone seems to pull away from me and I spend the downhill and then some catching up.
Congrats Jason. Get your legs back, fall is coming and riders will return to Z.
RojoRacing
Donut Powered Wise-guy
Your statements contradict themselves so which is it? do you get dropped on the climb and have to use the DH and then some to catch up or do you pull away on the climb?
CruzLike
Guru
I may have purposely used some misleading wording. I thought "no one can stay with me" sounds better than "they leave me in there dust" or "no one can ride as slow as me" At the top of the hill they are 20 seconds ahead.
Last night on a Z workout, I may have stretched my ability (mentally) to crank at high watts. Most of my training has been for endurance rides and not big power. When I crank out 130% efforts I'm concerned with burning the matches. I throttle myself to conserve. I think I can crank it up a little more without dying after that workout.
I noticed that you climb "the hill" (Hottinger Gasse) in about a minute. Myself, at 310w and 89kg, I climb it at 1:30. I would like to improve that time by 15 seconds. I plan to target about 400w. (150%) Those numbers are pretty close to my power curve. Not sure how repeatable it will be. We'll see.
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CruzLike
Guru
Since the time that you had this KOM, I have ridden a 7 lap race. That is what Jason and I have been recently talking about.
I finished my 7 laps just 10 seconds ahead of your 8 lap time. Job well done.
RojoRacing
Donut Powered Wise-guy
Well $hit with the UCI getting involved how long before bents are banned from the virtual world championships? Seem I may have waited to long to make me big debut on the Vendetta.
http://cruzbike.com/forum/threads/zwift-cruzbike-activities-races-and-group-rides.11477/
http://cruzbike.com/forum/threads/zwift-cruzbike-activities-races-and-group-rides.11477/
RojoRacing
Donut Powered Wise-guy
CruzLike
Guru
Jason thanks for the post. This video explains what you were commenting on in your previous post.
My thoughts of this has to do with controlling doping. Both virtual and real.
This is what I have noticed on Zwift. My stats put in securely in the middle of being a "C" racer. (here's some speculation) I believe that would place me in the 40 percentile of riders on Zwift. Maybe only 20% of Zwifters have the "A" and "B" performance abilities. That could elevate position to the 75 percentile in the people that Zwift.
When I'm in the real world, I feel like I'm a contender. I can mix it up with some fast riders. Most recently I rode 50 miles @24mph in a pretty flat course. I finished 1st. Here's another example KOM'd 15mile segment. 23.9mph. Did I just beat 327 D and C- riders? https://www.strava.com/activities/1731325835/segments/43379766764
I'm not sure if what I'm explaining is the Cruzbike effect or Zwift being area where people have the ability to play fair or bend the rules. What I'm explaining is the gap between real world and Z.
Does anyone agree or have a different take in real vs Zwift?
My thoughts of this has to do with controlling doping. Both virtual and real.
This is what I have noticed on Zwift. My stats put in securely in the middle of being a "C" racer. (here's some speculation) I believe that would place me in the 40 percentile of riders on Zwift. Maybe only 20% of Zwifters have the "A" and "B" performance abilities. That could elevate position to the 75 percentile in the people that Zwift.
When I'm in the real world, I feel like I'm a contender. I can mix it up with some fast riders. Most recently I rode 50 miles @24mph in a pretty flat course. I finished 1st. Here's another example KOM'd 15mile segment. 23.9mph. Did I just beat 327 D and C- riders? https://www.strava.com/activities/1731325835/segments/43379766764
I'm not sure if what I'm explaining is the Cruzbike effect or Zwift being area where people have the ability to play fair or bend the rules. What I'm explaining is the gap between real world and Z.
Does anyone agree or have a different take in real vs Zwift?
RojoRacing
Donut Powered Wise-guy
The short harsh reality answer is yes you just beat up on a bunch of C and D level riders. Being fast somewhere doesn't make you fast everywhere as I'm sure you already know and being fast everywhere is what is needed to be fast on zwift because people on zwift come from everywhere. I could take hundreds of local KOM's if I wanted but the truly contested ones I'd be lucky to break into the top 10 on a rare occasion. Those top 10's become top 100 or greater on zwift because it's no longer local riders only then add in the number of people on un-calibrated trainers and it becomes top 1000.
I'm not sure what rules the UCI plans to enforce since during these virtual world championship everyone has to show up to one location and all ride the exact same model of calibrated trainer. You'd be stupid to lie about your weight or cheat with your trainers calibration at home during the qualifying races just to show up and get weighed in 10kg heavier and down 30 watts on power compared to at home. Best case is you manage to qualify and show up and find out your trainer at home reads a little low and suddenly you gained 2% power at the worlds event(crossing my fingers that my NEO reads low). I guess with their backing they could start drug testing the athletes in these premier races but it's not like they need to enforce minimum bike weights or limit the ratio or aero designs on bike frames. I doubt something like a recumbent would even be a registered thought because no one fast on zwift has made much of an impression on one, but I can bet if a bent started winning these big events the UCI may just claim the position of a bent give an unfair advantage and separate them.
Balor
Zen MBB Master
Well, my trainer is certainly off by about 10% (actual numbers are less than that) - I've checked with a borrowed SRM once, maybe more now because it continues to slowly drip oil. Given my weight that I've fairly set, I will *not* be getting any KOMs any time soon and I could not care less.
Erm, since when, so far as raw power is concerned, recumbent position provide any 'unfair advantage'? This is the other way around, actually. More comfort - yes, but UCI cannot care less about it.
You'll just be lumped with everyone else using DF bike parameters (CRR, CdA), and how you'll generate require power would be your problem.
Erm, since when, so far as raw power is concerned, recumbent position provide any 'unfair advantage'? This is the other way around, actually. More comfort - yes, but UCI cannot care less about it.
You'll just be lumped with everyone else using DF bike parameters (CRR, CdA), and how you'll generate require power would be your problem.
RojoRacing
Donut Powered Wise-guy
Your forgetting the lack of logic used in these biased situations. If a bent were to win a big event and make DFs look inferior then there may be a backlash and random excuses made.
Remember that when I did my first 20,000’ double century I was supported and cheered on because they thought I didn’t have a chance. Once they realized I had a chance then suddenly I was removed from competition.
Remember that when I did my first 20,000’ double century I was supported and cheered on because they thought I didn’t have a chance. Once they realized I had a chance then suddenly I was removed from competition.
RojoRacing
Donut Powered Wise-guy
Remember the Vegan cyclist when he raced against the recumbent dork one year ago and couldn't even manage the sprint for the finish? Back then I'd say he and I were pretty close to equal but a year is a long time.
Well I ran across another video of his more recently and it seems he has gotten way way stronger to the point where I wouldn't even stand a chance right now. He's managing 61 watts more than I currently can over a 18 min segment, I know it's exactly 61 because I just tried to improve my time up one of our more contested segments and only managed 320 watt which is a PR but still a 16% difference which is massive when you're already as fast as I am. Not sure what kind of effort he put into netting those kind of gains but it's motivated me a little to try a little harder to try harder at being faster. Lets see is my motivation will hold out long enough to raise my 20 min effort to 350.
I'm still in limbo with my housing setup which is why I'm not on zwift and my overall riding is all over the place but I remain hopeful.
Well I ran across another video of his more recently and it seems he has gotten way way stronger to the point where I wouldn't even stand a chance right now. He's managing 61 watts more than I currently can over a 18 min segment, I know it's exactly 61 because I just tried to improve my time up one of our more contested segments and only managed 320 watt which is a PR but still a 16% difference which is massive when you're already as fast as I am. Not sure what kind of effort he put into netting those kind of gains but it's motivated me a little to try a little harder to try harder at being faster. Lets see is my motivation will hold out long enough to raise my 20 min effort to 350.
I'm still in limbo with my housing setup which is why I'm not on zwift and my overall riding is all over the place but I remain hopeful.
CruzLike
Guru
Wow Hardy, you get the gold star for today. I had to get out the dictionary on recalcitrant. Thanks for the mental stretch.
I will look forward to a Chop ride.
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RojoRacing
Donut Powered Wise-guy
That true on the DF bikes as well, it has to do with the pedal feedback of the trainer vs rolling outdoors.
We had a great Hound & Hare race tonight.
The D group started first with 5 riders; three on recumbents. I was on my trike again with @trplay and Connie. We were amazed that the group of 5 stayed together for 14 miles. Everyone even took turns pulling. Eventually the other two dropped, so we finished as the lone three D riders.
Ken took off with the C pack and what a group! He lead a group of about 10 riders and they caught us just after we finished the first lap. Looks like Ken finished either first or second among C riders according to Zwift Power. Probably top few of C’s overall.
We could use a few more joining up for some of these races. A few more D’s would help our little D group go faster. I’m looking forward to seeing some of our A racers finally getting out there and seeing how they stack up in power.
The D group started first with 5 riders; three on recumbents. I was on my trike again with @trplay and Connie. We were amazed that the group of 5 stayed together for 14 miles. Everyone even took turns pulling. Eventually the other two dropped, so we finished as the lone three D riders.
Ken took off with the C pack and what a group! He lead a group of about 10 riders and they caught us just after we finished the first lap. Looks like Ken finished either first or second among C riders according to Zwift Power. Probably top few of C’s overall.
We could use a few more joining up for some of these races. A few more D’s would help our little D group go faster. I’m looking forward to seeing some of our A racers finally getting out there and seeing how they stack up in power.
