Cruzbike Time Trial Challenge 2020

[CruzLike]

@LarryOz
I would like to change my TT route to the one @markciccio uses in his video. I like the scenery. Much different than the corn fields I ride through. Is it too late to change?

Thanks Mark for the video.

 

[DARYLHANGER945]

But the corn fields offer such a wind break I will take that over a nice view any day when pushing so hard that my vision is not the clearest. I have been so excited on my last two efforts to see the corn emerging from the ground. Hopefully will be over a foot high by my next effort. It will help since I just swapped my spoked front wheel out for my carbon covered disc last night.

While I don't do the power meter thing I do look at my HR data and my average HR was lower by 5 bpm 184 W4 from 189 W3 and my speed went up by .6 mph. Max HR 220-35=185. My cadence was about the same at 91 W3 and 90 W4. Strava estimates my power to have been 239 W3 and 258 W4. Both efforts were done about the same time of day, relative same wind speed and direction and about the same temp. The rides were only two days apart and in the morning before the heat built in.

 

[markciccio]

@LarryOz
I would like to change my TT route to the one @markciccio uses in his video. I like the scenery. Much different than the corn fields I ride through. Is it too late to change?

Thanks Mark for the video.

The Mottarone climb is one of the best in my area, if not the best, both for climbing training and for panorama. At the top you can see nearly the whole Pianura Padana, with all the northern lakes. Even Milan is clearly visible.
If you want to "virtually" make the climb, I share this video:

 

[ElyDave]

That's great Mark, my planned holiday this year was to Garda, with a brand new bike. I've been using BigRingVR on my turbo trainer, they have some rides in that area and it's as if you are there!

 

[markciccio]

The last Mottarone test, comparing the recumbent to my road bike:

 

[LarryOz]

The last Mottarone test, comparing the recumbent to my road bike:

Marco - Fantastic Video - love the prelude! It would be interesting to see the same test done with the Rev HTH

 

[markciccio]

Sooner or later I will

 

[RojoRacing]

The last Mottarone test, comparing the recumbent to my road bike:

thanks for the effort, I feel you struggling at the end to express your meaning of how weaker riders won’t necessarily see the same results on steep climbs but I know exactly what you’re trying to say.

I was very curious when you first showed strava segment results because even I don’t get equal times for equal power for a 9% climb. Then you said your bikes weigh the same but my V20 is 5 lbs heavier than my DF so that makes a difference.

another thing I’m curious about would be your gearing on each bike and how much you stand up on the DF bike. Besides my V20 outweighing my trek by 5 lbs I also get to switch muscles a bit when I stand up for those over ftp sections. My trek goes to 28t in the rear but the V20 gets one more at 32t so even in the areas I can’t stand I’m still managing the same cadence.

 

[Kathleen Palmer]

Hello Everyone,
Well the first week is over and what a huge turnout!
We had 53 people ride their TT for week #1! - a record by far!

What a fantastic group and I thank each of you for participating.
I counted people from 17 states in the US, and riders from Australia(1), UK(4), New Zealand (1), Italy(1), and Canada (1) (Thanks for making this a truly international field!)
I look forward to seeing each of your progress as the weeks roll by.

I will provide a weekly summary showing all riders and their times, points, and other "data".
I will also provide a weekly "category list" showing weekly "winners" in each category (and current leader in each category), and may bring attention to a specific standout ride or 2.

Remember this is primarily about getting stronger more fit and learning how to go the fastest on what you ride. Your main competition is yourself. Don't get too wrapped up in the points "race". It's fun to have numbers to crunch and add up is all. That is why I created all the other categories. If you can think of "other" categories you would like me to add, please send me an email and explain what you would like. I can add as many as people would like to see. (We may not have "Awards" for all of them in the end, but it is fun to have different data to look at each week.)

If you see your name with a yellow highlight in one of the cells, that means I need some information from you.
Right now, I need segments from 2 people and weight for 3 other people (see #DIV/0!).
You do not need to give me your weight unless you are giving me power numbers from a power meter (that is needed to calculate watts/kg)
I pulled your location from your Strava profile. Please check in in column 2 - if wrong, please shoot me an email with correct info.

I know this is a ton of data (my eyes are crossed from entering and looking at it!). I also ask each of you to double check your time and any other data (watts, Hr, cad) that is listed for you. With all this data entry it is hard to get it 100%, so I will rely on each of you to double check the numbers and report back to me if I have any errors. Please email me and do not post needed corrections on the forum thread - Thanks.

Once again - welcome to everyone - and I look forward to a great challenge.
Larry

View attachment 9417
View attachment 9418

Hello Everyone,
Well the first week is over and what a huge turnout!
We had 53 people ride their TT for week #1! - a record by far!

What a fantastic group and I thank each of you for participating.
I counted people from 17 states in the US, and riders from Australia(1), UK(4), New Zealand (1), Italy(1), and Canada (1) (Thanks for making this a truly international field!)
I look forward to seeing each of your progress as the weeks roll by.

I will provide a weekly summary showing all riders and their times, points, and other "data".
I will also provide a weekly "category list" showing weekly "winners" in each category (and current leader in each category), and may bring attention to a specific standout ride or 2.

Remember this is primarily about getting stronger more fit and learning how to go the fastest on what you ride. Your main competition is yourself. Don't get too wrapped up in the points "race". It's fun to have numbers to crunch and add up is all. That is why I created all the other categories. If you can think of "other" categories you would like me to add, please send me an email and explain what you would like. I can add as many as people would like to see. (We may not have "Awards" for all of them in the end, but it is fun to have different data to look at each week.)

If you see your name with a yellow highlight in one of the cells, that means I need some information from you.
Right now, I need segments from 2 people and weight for 3 other people (see #DIV/0!).
You do not need to give me your weight unless you are giving me power numbers from a power meter (that is needed to calculate watts/kg)
I pulled your location from your Strava profile. Please check in in column 2 - if wrong, please shoot me an email with correct info.

I know this is a ton of data (my eyes are crossed from entering and looking at it!). I also ask each of you to double check your time and any other data (watts, Hr, cad) that is listed for you. With all this data entry it is hard to get it 100%, so I will rely on each of you to double check the numbers and report back to me if I have any errors. Please email me and do not post needed corrections on the forum thread - Thanks.

Once again - welcome to everyone - and I look forward to a great challenge.
Larry

View attachment 9417
View attachment 9418

 

[Kathleen Palmer]

I have stuck with the amazing time trial now for 4 weeks. Where can I find these posted results week to week? Thank you.

 

[RojoRacing]

I have stuck with the amazing time trial now for 4 weeks. Where can I find these posted results week to week? Thank you.

pretty sure Larry only sends them via direct email to the address you use to submit your results. If you haven't been getting them then check your spam.

 

[trplay]

Is week 4 out?

 

[RojoRacing]

Is week 4 out?

not yet

 

[markciccio]

I know it could be a little off-topic but I am trying to use all the data of this "competition" to analyse some different behaviour of the bikes and also to try to "improve" in this competition as well. At the moment I am focusing on how much the position affects the development of power. And this is the reason I posted the video. If it is too much of topic, just let me know.

thanks for the effort, I feel you struggling at the end to express your meaning of how weaker riders won’t necessarily see the same results on steep climbs but I know exactly what you’re trying to say.

I was very curious when you first showed strava segment results because even I don’t get equal times for equal power for a 9% climb. Then you said your bikes weigh the same but my V20 is 5 lbs heavier than my DF so that makes a difference.

another thing I’m curious about would be your gearing on each bike and how much you stand up on the DF bike. Besides my V20 outweighing my trek by 5 lbs I also get to switch muscles a bit when I stand up for those over ftp sections. My trek goes to 28t in the rear but the V20 gets one more at 32t so even in the areas I can’t stand I’m still managing the same cadence.

I always used the same wheels and same cassette for the two bikes, for all the climbs. For that test I had 3 +3 climbs in a period of 2 weeks. I used the 11-28 cassette for the first 4 climbs but for the last 2 (the ones of the video) a 11-32 cassette, that worked very well but I used the 32 gear only the steepest part (+15%, there are 5 sections of 100-150 meters each, so I could pedal at about 70 rpm). On those parts I usually stand upon the DF but it is a matter of few seconds. If you see the data, the cadence is nearly the same for the two bikes (68 rpm for the recumbent, 70rpm for the DF). On the DF I have a 172,5 mm crank, on the recumbent 170 mm. The bikes weight exactly the same: 9.3 kg each, 87.5 kg (193 lb) at the start with me (77 kg), the bike and all the other stuff.
As for the theretical power you need to climb with a bike on a 8% climb with 12,4 km/h, you can use the Ambrosini formula that works always very well and you'll find you need 268W, while I used 273 with the recumbent, so quite near. As for the DF, the Ambrosini formula power result is 264.55 while I used 263. See this page: https://www.rivaluta.it/ciclismo/watt.asp

I also ask Larry if he could update the discussion with the results of the last 2 weeks, should be very interesting for all...

 

[RojoRacing]

I know it could be a little off-topic but I am trying to use all the data of this "competition" to analyse some different behaviour of the bikes and also to try to "improve" in this competition as well. At the moment I am focusing on how much the position affects the development of power. And this is the reason I posted the video. If it is too much of topic, just let me know.


I always used the same wheels and same cassette for the two bikes, for all the climbs. For that test I had 3 +3 climbs in a period of 2 weeks. I used the 11-28 cassette for the first 4 climbs but for the last 2 (the ones of the video) a 11-32 cassette, that worked very well but I used the 32 gear only the steepest part (+15%, there are 5 sections of 100-150 meters each, so I could pedal at about 70 rpm). On those parts I usually stand upon the DF but it is a matter of few seconds. If you see the data, the cadence is nearly the same for the two bikes (68 rpm for the recumbent, 70rpm for the DF). On the DF I have a 172,5 mm crank, on the recumbent 170 mm. The bikes weight exactly the same: 9.3 kg each, 87.5 kg (193 lb) at the start with me (77 kg), the bike and all the other stuff.
As for the theretical power you need to climb with a bike on a 8% climb with 12,4 km/h, you can use the Ambrosini formula that works always very well and you'll find you need 268W, while I used 273 with the recumbent, so quite near. As for the DF, the Ambrosini formula power result is 264.55 while I used 263. See this page: https://www.rivaluta.it/ciclismo/watt.asp

I also ask Larry if he could update the discussion with the results of the last 2 weeks, should be very interesting for all...

I'd second we could take this to its own thread to more deeply discuss your ongoing results. I wasn't going to say anything because every thread on this forum gets derailed after the second page and I've given up on expecting anything less :lol

If you're testing for power vs body position then I think you should seriously consider adding in the variable of more standing recovery or surging over longer periods of those steeper parts, its a sin how few very experienced roadies get out of the saddle. I would always make up the most time over my friends on longer climbs when we crest a steeper part and their legs were burning from the harder effort but I was just sitting back down and transitioning back to recovered my primary muscle group. Watt to watt climbing time it won't make a difference but the technique could enable you to unlock a few % more power overall because you're incorporating that second position that the DF bike can use. I wouldn't expect to see clear results right away though because it would take practice to mentally adapt to the harder efforts and taxing recovery period after. The way I got good at it was I'd pick certain steep parts in a climb and pick a tree, pole or other land markers over the crest as my finish goal. No matter how my legs left I forced myself to stay out of the saddle till I reached that finish line and I'd adjust my pacing and technique each time until I found something that worked to my advantage. To be clear the #1 mistake most people make practicing what I just said is they always treat out of the saddle as a surging effort and completely disregard that the position at the same effort can be used to recover your legs depending on how a climbs features play out. Would you benefit more from surging up this steep part and recovering on the next part or do you recover out of the saddle so you can continue to go hard on the next sections? My dad and I raced up the same 70 min climb 2-3 times a week over like 6 months and I naturally learned the technique of switching positions as I tried to save off second and second from the PR.

 

[RojoRacing]

@ccooper read em and weep, week 5 done, I’ve got your number

 

[ccooper]

@ccooper read em and weep, week 5 done, I’ve got your number

Which number, Jason? The old one, or did you also surpass this week's new one?
It's a moving target, you know.

 

[RojoRacing]

well @LarryOz hasn't posted week 4 yet so we don't know yet, but you better stay sharp for week 5

 

[LarryOz]

well @LarryOz hasn't posted week 4 yet so we don't know yet, but you better stay sharp for week 5

Please bear with me for the results. I give everyone until the end of the day on Monday to post their rides. After that it takes me quite a while to get everything finalized and doubled checked. I just sent out the emails to everyone. I will post the Week #2, Week #3 and Week #4 numbers here too

 

[LarryOz]

Week #2 results: