2022 Vendetta V20c with carbon fiber front end

chicorider

Zen MBB Master
I asked @Robert Holler similar questions before the V20c was set for release. He told me back then that there would be two chain stay lengths--the standard length that ships with the bike, and a longer one. I would guess that the longer stay would become available around the same time the curved slider is. Also, the asymmetric shape of the boom and slider tells me that the curved slider will only lower the bars, not raise them.
 

LarryOz

Cruzeum Curator & Sigma Wrangler
I asked @Robert Holler similar questions before the V20c was set for release. He told me back then that there would be two chain stay lengths--the standard length that ships with the bike, and a longer one. I would guess that the longer stay would become available around the same time the curved slider is. Also, the asymmetric shape of the boom and slider tells me that the curved slider will only lower the bars, not raise them.
That is true - it only has one position - this makes it nice as you don't have to figit with getting it lined up correctly. Curved slider and longer chainstay - I suggest just emailing Cruzbike and ask them if it available. I think it might be available even if you don't see a part for it on the webpage.
 

BJ686

Well-Known Member
Curved slider and longer chainstay - I suggest just emailing Cruzbike and ask them if it available. I think it might be available even if you don't see a part for it on the webpage.
I ordered the longer chainstay when I ordered my frameset (it wasnt an option, I just emailed and ordered separately).
 

Robert Holler

Administrator
Staff member
There are two stays - standard (will work for just about everyone) and a longer one for taller riders. We will also be having a longer one made for tall riders (or really tall riders) and people who want to really lower the bars and go for high BB positions - but that longest version won't be here for a while (supply chain issues abound y'all)
 

Bill Wightman

Well-Known Member
Hi, on my DFs I started running Shimano Br8000s.
Yes, I scavenged some side-pull good quality Shimano brakes off my archived DF and have put one in back with much improved braking. I left an aero center pull brake in front. Brake problem fixed.
 

Braulio

Member
For me the new bike seems expensive. If I was the guy that wants the win win chicken dinner then its a no brainer. I think if I had this bike it would only be ridden in competitions and put in its travel case the rest of the time. My latest build is the fastest. 12 speed , 1 deuralleur , no hoods... just an up / down button on the bars and 2 small levers brakes. Weight saving ... I will have to buy a meter but it feels like a kilo.View attachment 13055
What chainring is that?
 

Braulio

Member
Has anyone done any testing on a V20 of the effect of weight on speed on flat roads? Like repeat a loop twice in same conditions at same power level with a 2kg weight difference (full vs empty hydration or something that does not effect aero). I'm pretty sure it would make no difference. The weight is only a factor when hills come into the mix... and even then, probably mainly sustained hills rather than rolling short hills. Having a lighter V20 will certainly improve its climbing.... but really the V20 is the wrong bike for that if climbing long climbs is the aim. I personally would choose a light DF, or something more upright and probably not MBB (for stability) for long steep climbing on a bent. I personally find the MBB a chore for steep long climbing at >10% and prefer a bike I can ride at 5kph with steering stability. I can do the climbing on the V20, but I have to push myself to put out my power to get to a speed that MBB and can work (say 8-10kph+), and that may not be desired if trying to do a long ride and trying to manage the effort.

Of course if you want the ultimate V20 style bike, then the lightest and the most aero is the best... but I think the weight makes little difference to most people with V20s, and the aero is much more significant given this is a bike for going fast where aero matters.
Could it be that you feel unstable on climbs because you're grinding too hard of a gear?
 

DavidCH

In thought; expanding the paradigm of traversity
If you want to run the chainring with a sram flatop chain then you need to send a a special message to the supplier...
 

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Beano

Well-Known Member
You are a Madman! I did some sustained (for me) 9% grades on my titanium DF bike recently that I couldn't have done on my V20 even if I switched to an 11/34t.

You are right Vos, forget climbing. Just because some people can keep a V20 upright at 6kph doesn't mean they should. I haven't seen or read of anyone doing a weight/speed test. I am sure there is a formula for it, but my simple thought is that it would help most in acceleration since aero trumps weight on the flats, which is actually most of the reason I want the Multi-clicks instead of the brifters. About the weight being higher (COG) it might affect the handling a bit, but it is probably so insignificant as to be undetectable to most riders, or at the least easily accustomed to.
Why not? Climbing on a recumbent comes down to two things, w/kg and careful gear selection that allows you to still keep a high cadence >90 whilst still being within threshold or the lower limit of your VO2.

This website I find it okayish for playing around with the power numbers.
 
Why not? Climbing on a recumbent comes down to two things, w/kg and careful gear selection that allows you to still keep a high cadence >90 whilst still being within threshold or the lower limit of your VO2.

This website I find it okayish for playing around with the power numbers.

There is more to it than that. If you are only doing climbs less than 7-8%, that mostly applies. Once you start getting to some really steep stuff, you get to a point where it is difficult to get any gearing that keeps your cadence high. Your speed gets low and stability is an issue on a v20, and it is difficult to keep it stable in the full reclined position so you have to pull yourself forward which is not sustainable long term. Also grip becomes an issue and you start to spin the unweighted front wheel.

I regularly climb steep stuff. There are some rides I do on my DF I just won't do on my V20. There are others where I just have to make it happen for a minute or two of suffering to get over a steep lump to complete the rest of the ride that suits the V20. In contrast on my DF, grip is not an issue unless I tackle the steepest stuff in the wet. Stability is not an issue as I can stand at very low cadence down to 2-3kph if I need to.
 

Frito Bandito

Zen MBB Master
@Beano
Thanks for the link. It's a great tool for estimating speed for various kinds of bikes.
As for the speed on climbing, my balance on the V20 starts to get dodgy at about 6kph because I spend most of my time trying to bleed out as much speed on the V20 as I can and avoiding the climbs as much as possible. I can keep it sunny side up, but on public roads I will likely become a safety hazard to others.
With that said, I went back to my Strava rides to search for my activity on some of the climbs of the Tokyo Olympic route, which was about 40km of climbs to see how my V20 compared on a strong effort against my Litespeed T1 road bike also with a strong effort. I couldn't find the exact ride on my T1 but I remember being dead tired afterwards. My V20 ride later left me equally tired, so the only thing I can show is the Strava PRs. I know it's not solid evidence without the power data and other factors but here it is...

 

Henri

scatter brain
I want to be able to take my V20c on as many roads and paths as possible, so I want to get the maximum tire width (at least on one set of wheels and maybe have another one more aero specific). When planning on a smaller diameter rim (like 650B) the limiting spot seems to be by the bottom bracket because the chain stays go more narrow then seems necessary to me. Will the longer chain stays move this narrow spot further away so I get more width in the area where the tire will actually be? I think, I might get the longer chain stays anyway, but that would seal the deal for me!
 

Frito Bandito

Zen MBB Master
I want to be able to take my V20c on as many roads and paths as possible, so I want to get the maximum tire width (at least on one set of wheels and maybe have another one more aero specific). When planning on a smaller diameter rim (like 650B) the limiting spot seems to be by the bottom bracket because the chain stays go more narrow then seems necessary to me. Will the longer chain stays move this narrow spot further away so I get more width in the area where the tire will actually be? I think, I might get the longer chain stays anyway, but that would seal the deal for me!
I think it will Henry. From other posts here on the V20c it looks like it can already handle 700c tires wider than 28mm, so check on that first before you spend money on new wheels. Mine is the 2018 model with short chainstays. I have a 28mm on front and there seems to be plenty of chainstay width to get wider, maybe up to 32mm but I don't think I need it here because the roads are in great shape. The rear on mine seems to be limited to 28mm unless I drop to a 650. If I were to need wider than 28mm then I'd probably buy 650 wheels which are available here in limited numbers.
 

Apollo

Well-Known Member
I think it will Henry. From other posts here on the V20c it looks like it can already handle 700c tires wider than 28mm, so check on that first before you spend money on new wheels. Mine is the 2018 model with short chainstays. I have a 28mm on front and there seems to be plenty of chainstay width to get wider, maybe up to 32mm but I don't think I need it here because the roads are in great shape. The rear on mine seems to be limited to 28mm unless I drop to a 650. If I were to need wider than 28mm then I'd probably buy 650 wheels which are available here in limited numbers.
Yes, Larry already mounted 700C 32mm tires on his V20C prototype and posted it the other thread. It's confirmed, the V20C frame can handle wider tires than previous generations. The only thing I'm wondering is whether or not tires that wide actually make sense on an optimised pure race machine. That's something only the owner can answer.
 

Frito Bandito

Zen MBB Master
Yes, Larry already mounted 700C 32mm tires on his V20C prototype and posted it the other thread. It's confirmed, the V20C frame can handle wider tires than previous generations. The only thing I'm wondering is whether or not tires that wide actually make sense on an optimised pure race machine. That's something only the owner can answer.
Yep. High psi aerodynamic skinny tires for smooth roads and wider lower psi tires absorbing bumps on worse roads. If people have the money having 2 sets of wheels and tires to match road conditions is great. For most though, 1 set that isn't terrible in either condition is what we roll with. Since the wind direction and speed is never constant it is uncommon for riders to be in that certain condition to benefit where manufacturers claim their wheels are the fastest, ie speed at 37.2kph and wind direction at 7.4 degrees. This sure makes it hard for me to justify spending about $2000 on a new set of wheels even though I really want to upgrade.
 

chicorider

Zen MBB Master
After riding 25mm Schwalbe Pro Ones for years on my V20, I switched to 30mm Pro Ones on my V20c. Strava seems to think that they are at least as fast as their skinnier cousins, but what I notice most is the smoother ride on the mixed-quality road surfaces I've been dealt where I live. And on a V, a smoother ride that is no slower is pretty sweet.
 

Henri

scatter brain
Whell, I am not terribly fast, get to around 40kph/25mph. a few millimeters of tire probably won't be too bad for my, as I tend to get into some corse asphalt when my route to a destination leads my over little used / agriculturally used roads. And when riding through fields and forests and by the canal, that's not paved, but I don't want to buy a full extra bike, so a second pair of wheels will be the cheaper way.
 
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